Fireball vs. Wind Wall

[Lord Pendragon]

Can an arrow fired from a composite longbow travel over 1000 feet without a range increment? Sorry to keep harping on about it, but this part of my argument keeps getting ignored.

The range increment bit is meaningless, as far as I can tell. All that matters is maximum distance. And an arrow can indeed be fired 1000 ft. with the proper feats and bow.

In any case, as it turns out the point was moot for our party. Last night our seven member team of 8th-level PCs ambushed a goblin army. In the surprise round, the cleric threw up a Wind Wall which served admirably to deflect the army's missile fire. The DM ruled that the Fireball spell is unaffected by the Wind Wall, so our party wizard stood behind the Wind Wall and blasted the army with Fireball after Fireball. I'd been concerned about enemy spellcasters throwing Fireballs back at us, (which is why I posed the question of Wind Wall possibly blocking Fireball,) but it turns out they didn't have that kind of firepower.

I didn't anticipate the several enemy leaders that drank potions of Invisibility, nor the flying super-bugbears, nor the Cones of Cold and Javelins of Lightning that were thrown around. But hey, no plan can take everything into account versus an enemy we'd never fought before!

All in all, the plan worked like a charm, and our party destroyed the entire goblin army. It was a fantastic combat that lasted the entire session long (the DM had all 150+ goblin enemies set up on the gaming table when we got there! Our ranger was not thrilled with the idea of us "ambushing" them. )

Many thanks to everyone who's chimed in on this thread.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

If fireball was a conjuration effect I might consider wind wall having an effect as an evocation that bead is almost certainly not a physical bead but some bead of energy which wouldn't be effected by wind.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

I'm almost afraid to answer, but what the hell. I just picked up my comics, so I'm feeling optimistic.

OT but since it seems your in my neck of the woods where do you pick up your comics?

 

[MerakSpielman]

IMHO, the 'bead' is insubstantial.

I would agree with this. I see no reason to believe that the "bead" is a solid object. Though not entirely flavor text, I don't think the "bead" is meant to follow any of the rules for missiles.

 

[Plane Sailing]

The only way that the fireball bead differs from any other spell is that it has a special effect that allows it to get past line of effect rules in certain situations.

Only way? You forget that it can suffer premature detonation (does that sound rude?) and that is a way in which it clearly differs from other spells.

Cheers

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Only way? You forget that it can suffer premature detonation (does that sound rude?) and that is a way in which it clearly differs from other spells.

I think that was covered pretty adequately when I said it was an exception to line of effect rules.


Jeff

 

[Jeff Wilder]

OT but since it seems your in my neck of the woods where do you pick up your comics?

A small shop called Isotope on Noriega, between 23rd and 24th Avenues (in The City). Great shop ... if you make it up here, you should come by.


Jeff

 

[Plane Sailing]

I think that was covered pretty adequately when I said it was an exception to line of effect rules.

I assumed that you were talking there about the benefit that it can shoot through holes which would otherwise block line of effect (e.g. you can fireball through an arrow slit and out the other side, but not use a lightning bolt).

Cheers

 

[Gez]

I hate to stir up the waters any more, but what about other spells?

Just my opinions/house rules, but:

Fireball: a small physical bead. Definitely smaller and lighter than a sling bullet. Always deflected.
HOWEVER: fireball's area of effect, once the bead detonates, is not deflected by the wind wall. There's no blast nor pressure in the explosion (there was a thread about that) so it is a proof that the flames are a magical effect that doesn't care about atmospheric conditions.
Magic missile: raw energy that strikes unerringly and can pierce dimensional barriers (force effects extends in the ethereal, remember). Never deflected.
Melf's acid arrow: create physical matter (corrosive liquid). Deflected like arrows.
Acid splash: likewise.
Lightning bolt: not affected.

 

[Gez]

If fireball was a conjuration effect, I might consider wind wall having an effect; as an evocation, that bead is almost certainly not a physical bead, but some bead of energy which wouldn't be effected by wind.

Added some commas and semi-colons to try to parse out the meaning better.

I disagree with you. A spell do not need to a conjuration to be a physical thing. Look at fireball's material component -- this is the bead. A bit of sulfur and bat guano rolled into a tiny bead, and when you cast the spell, you throw that bead.