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For real this time: What is your stance on 4e

What is your current stance on 4e?

  • I love 4e and am not going back to 3.x

    Votes: 117 41.2%
  • I love 4e but still will play 3.x

    Votes: 41 14.4%
  • I like 4e and 3.x the same

    Votes: 15 5.3%
  • I like 4e but still love 3.x more, but I have not played 4e or own the books

    Votes: 5 1.8%
  • I like 4e and have played it or own books, but I still love 3.x more

    Votes: 17 6.0%
  • I dislike 4e and have played it and own the books

    Votes: 23 8.1%
  • I dislike 4e and have played it but do not own the books

    Votes: 12 4.2%
  • I dislike 4e and own the books but I have not played it

    Votes: 20 7.0%
  • I dislike 4e but have not played it and do not own the books

    Votes: 34 12.0%

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I don't see either 4E or 3E as 'superior' than the other. They are different games attempting to model high fantasy adventuring with dice, minis, and paper & pencil.

With that said, I dislike 4E as feeling incomplete mainly because 4E so far lacks official versions of several staple 3E classes (bbn, bard, druid, monk, sor) and seems to gut the spell selections of the cleric & wizard. 4E also continued the split-personality Ranger. In other respects 4E seems far too "video-gamey".

Don't get me wrong; there are things about 4E I'm starting to warm up to: the method of reckoning skill bonuses (if not the actual trimmed-down list), the standardization of weapon traits, the encumbrance system, the reworking of saves/defenses (casters do need to be making attack rolls for everything as do the martial classes), the higher initial HP amounts. But 4E goes too far in other areas: the aforementioned minimalist skill set (and the equally austere selection of weapons & armor - not tomention the adventuring gear table!!), the retention of LG & CE alignment spaces, the replacement of the rich variety of spell geometries of 3E with square-shaped areas for everything...

4E's rules system seems well-suited for managing combat in a modern setting, where characters aren't to be expected to command eldritch magic or innate supernatural powers, but 4E D&D seems to be a round-peg fantasy world being pounded into a square-hole modern-day game system.

For all its flaws, 3.5E works, though slowly and with effort. I have plenty of books with plot ideas which would give me a variety of campaigns enough to last years and years. My gaming buddies all know the system and they have taken a wait-and-see-what-I-think approach to 4E. I had high hopes that 4E would give me that same thrill just from reading the rules as 3E had when we were still playing with 2E rules. It didn't. Maybe if the 4E PHB had been doubled in size, included the missing 5 classes, was more generous with its list of weapons & armor & adventuring gear, my verdict would be more positive, but I am going to have to tell my friends that for now, 4E is not worth switching to. PHB2 may reverse my opinion, but for now we are sticking with 3.5E. Sorry.
 
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dougmander said:
Actively dislike the direction 4e has taken, and don't need to spend $90 on the core books to confirm my suspicions, based on reading many, many reviews of the game. So I'm out of D&D entirely -- the mental gymnastics of running high level 3e games has burned me out, and 4e has basically gutted the game for me, so bye-bye.
Castles and Crusades or WFRP are fine alternatives...
 


All silliness from the "You don't like the new edition? Tell me about it!" megathread aside, I'm sticking with 3e (Pathfinder, specifically) for the simple fact that I'm happy with it. There are plenty of reasons why it hits the spot for me, but that's what it comes down to. 4e just never really caught my interest, either in the previews, or when looking at the books. So it never made it onto my radar in any real way. It seems to be enjoyable enough for plenty of folks, and that's just fine. Me, I'm all set with what I have. So that's what I voted :)
 


This is a bad poll.

"Do you like 4e? Oh man, HOW MUCH do you SERIOUSLY LOVE IT, is it REALLY better then 3e, or KINDA better then 3e, or WAY better then 3e?"

"Do you dislike 4e? You haven't read the books, have you. I bet you haven't played it either."
 

What can I say. It's not that 4e is a bad game, a lot of math issues were fixed. But they made it a game I don't particularly want to play or DM. I DM'ed 3e into the epic levels and never had a problem.

To use Najo's examples
Najo said:
Animate spells (making furiture move like animals)
Growth spells (giant sized children or cute animals is bad)
Polymorph abuse (dropping whales on people kind of stuff)
Death being trival
Un-heroic moments with to much randomness (hit points, save or die)
Those were some of my favorite elements of previous editions of D&D.

As for these
Najo said:
Buff spells and boosting items being necessary
Christmas Tree effect
the old-style gnome (the new one to me is much less silly)
With some work you could dump the buff spells and boost items, and I hardly used any of the standard PHB races anyway.
 

3.0, 3.5, 3.561746756 and all other versions of D&D are dead to me except for 4th. I only have time to care about one game and for me the dynamics of 4E work very well.
 



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