D&D 5E Giving Fighters nice things...

[LapBandit]

I am considering the following changes to Fighters and would like to get some feedback:

Hit Die: D12
Extra Attack: 4th, 9th, 15th
Indomitable: Goes from a re-roll to an auto-success.

Champions: 5th level: Free Savage Attacker feat.
Champions: Remarkable Athelete: Add your entire proficiency to Str, Dex, and Con checks that do not already include it. Increase your vertical and horizontal jump by 1X Str Mod for standing and 2x STR Mod for running jumps.

Eldritch Knight: Choose any two schools.

Battle Master: At 7th level, you can expend an additional Superiority Die on a maneuver.

 

[UnknownDyson]

If you don't care about game balance, sure add the changes. That is part of the beauty of 5e, the edition encourages alterations and home rulings. With that being said, the changes you are making are definitely unbalanced.

 

[Lanliss]

all looks fine to me, except for the free feat. If you are in a game that does not use feats, it might be functional. Any other game, fighters get enough feats as it is. This might actually result in fighters running out of feats to pick, and having full stats where they want to be. Then they have to decide if they want their Gladiator to have +2 to intelligence, or the Gourmand feat.

Not sure what I would use to replace the feat option though. Maybe increase damage die for all melee weapons? Move everything up a step, and d12 weapons go up to 1d6+1d8?

 

[LapBandit]

If you don't care about game balance, sure add the changes. That is part of the beauty of 5e, the edition encourages alterations and home rulings. With that being said, the changes you are making are definitely unbalanced.

I do care about game balance and relative strength of classes and archetypes against each other. Could you explain why you feel these prospective changes alters that negatively?

 

[LapBandit]

all looks fine to me, except for the free feat. If you are in a game that does not use feats, it might be functional. Any other game, fighters get enough feats as it is. This might actually result in fighters running out of feats to pick, and having full stats where they want to be. Then they have to decide if they want their Gladiator to have +2 to intelligence, or the Gourmand feat.

Not sure what I would use to replace the feat option though. Maybe increase damage die for all melee weapons? Move everything up a step, and d12 weapons go up to 1d6+1d8?

I did consider letting champions hit harder but it adds accounting to the archetype I was hoping to avoid. Also, the 2d6-> and d12 -> damage die steps are tricky.

 

[Lanliss]

I did consider letting champions hit harder but it adds accounting to the archetype I was hoping to avoid. Also, the 2d6-> and d12 -> damage die steps are tricky.

Yeah, I realized that after I posted. Trying to think of a good way to handle them that allows the current setup to remain, with 2d6 being a higher average but d12 being more likely to spike. It would add even more accounting, but you could make 2d6 into 1d6+2d4. Same maximum, but higher average ( but also d4, which I understand a lot of people hate.)

EDIT: As a matter of fact, I like these changes so much that I think I will add them to my houserules document immediately, while keeping my adjustment to damage dice. As a gut feeling, I like it, and I am learning lately that my gut feeling is usually right with regards to my group. More often than when I start actually thinking into deeper implications anyway.

 

[MostlyDm]

I do care about game balance and relative strength of classes and archetypes against each other. Could you explain why you feel these prospective changes alters that negatively?

Because it seems to be predicated on the idea that Fighters are significantly under-powered and need some sizable boosts.

If someone disagrees with that assessment, then this will look clearly unbalanced.

 

[Charles Rampant]

Fighters are already one of the most powerful classes. With these changes, I don't know why anyone would bother playing a Paladin, War Cleric, Barbarian or other martial option.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Hit Die: D12

More the barbarian's thing, but really pretty minor. 2 hps + 1/level.

Extra Attack: 4th, 9th, 15th

OK, faster.
I'd be more inclined to push out everyone else's extra attacks than pull in the fighters...

Indomitable: Goes from a re-roll to an auto-success.

OK. I'd outright give fighters proficiency in more saves.

Champions: Remarkable Athelete: Add your entire proficiency to Str, Dex, and Con checks that do not already include it.

So, you get no benefit from proficiency? Odd. How about keeping it at 1/2 proficiency but letting it stack?

I do care about game balance and relative strength of classes and archetypes against each other. Could you explain why you feel these prospective changes alters that negatively?

They are mostly just bigger numbers, making the fighter slightly better at his best-at-fighting thing. So 'nice things' IDK, 'big things' yeah. The fighter is already designed to be particularly good at DPR (and pretty good toughness) to make up for being not particularly good at much else.

 

[Eubani]

Fighters do not lack power. What they do lack is the ability to do more then HP damage in combat and a lack of non combat agency. These issues become more pronounced the higher the level you look at.