James McMurray
First Post
Dang, sounds like a bad death after a briliant response to a challenge. Of course, I don't have the whole story, only a minor blurb. But it sure sounds unfair to me.
Have you ever killed a PC on purpose?
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evileeyore
Mrrrph
WayneLigon said:
Wow. That was a craptastic way to do him in. Having played neonates (Low Level Vamps) who got lucky and staked out Methusalas (High Level Vamps) in games before, I say you should have given him a chance. Beside he might have managed (through luck) to escape and earn an enemy for life. Much better than earning a new character over an STs whims.
Yes; and on more than a few occasions. Sometimes a player is a dink and they ruined the game for other players. That's unacceptable to me. Am I proud of what I did? Damn straight. I did what I had to do, to make sure that all (or most) of the players are having a good time. One idiot should not be allowed to screw the campaign or cause real world problems.
With this being said, I never did those things because a player argued with me, or disagreed with a ruling or because I had an argument with them outside of the game. I don't believe a bolt out of the blue to kill a PC because the player is being difficult. I don't punish people for being players, only when they are causing too many problems for the other players.
With this being said, I never did those things because a player argued with me, or disagreed with a ruling or because I had an argument with them outside of the game. I don't believe a bolt out of the blue to kill a PC because the player is being difficult. I don't punish people for being players, only when they are causing too many problems for the other players.
Numion
First Post
Hell yeah I've "done in" PCs on purpose. One of the most spectacular cases involved Hellfire missiles, miniguns and rocket salvoes. That was in Cyberpunk though, where it's kinda expected from time to time.
I've not done that in D&D though. Hmm.. maybe I should just to try it out
I've not done that in D&D though. Hmm.. maybe I should just to try it out
MarauderX
Explorer
good thread, interesting deaths.
I went after a paladin-esque fighter-cleric once, but let everyone know what was coming. Their goal was to save him at all costs; the mage's guild was to kill him at all costs. Was great for battles, and 2 PCs died (not the target, they missed fireball saves) before they won but leading them into a trap. The PCs were anti-magiced up, and led the baddies and their conjured critters out onto a log jam at a lumber camp. Whenever they got close, the water-breathing target would spin the log underneath the baddies while the high-Dex rogue just went along for the ride to lure them in. Still couldn't kill the target despite two water elementals, and the rest of the party enjoyed being completely ignored for once. Gotta say, that was a fun session as a DM, the players foiled nearly everything I had in my arsenal.
I went after a paladin-esque fighter-cleric once, but let everyone know what was coming. Their goal was to save him at all costs; the mage's guild was to kill him at all costs. Was great for battles, and 2 PCs died (not the target, they missed fireball saves) before they won but leading them into a trap. The PCs were anti-magiced up, and led the baddies and their conjured critters out onto a log jam at a lumber camp. Whenever they got close, the water-breathing target would spin the log underneath the baddies while the high-Dex rogue just went along for the ride to lure them in. Still couldn't kill the target despite two water elementals, and the rest of the party enjoyed being completely ignored for once. Gotta say, that was a fun session as a DM, the players foiled nearly everything I had in my arsenal.
heimdall
Dwarven Guardian
It just happened in one of my games. I had been pulling punches for a while and the players had drifted into that comfort zone of thinking no matter how stupid they were in combat, somehow they were going to come through it all. So I sent out the email saying if they continued to behave in such a fashion a character was likely to die. I reminded them at the beginning of the game session. Towards the end of the night, the ranger gets stuck fighting the two worgs by himself. The rest of the party, including the two massive fighters, go after the goblins one at a time, leaving him to fend for himself. The only one who tries to assist is the Kender rogue/cleric with his puny rapier. The mage with the heavy duty spells, including lightning bolt, continue to go after the goblins. The psion with his force missiles (using ITCK) is also popping at the globins. Meanwhile, the lightly armed ranger (did I mention he had chosen to go down the archer path) is getting wiped.
The Kender gets over there, but by then it's too late. The mage could have set himself up and lightning bolted both worgs. Either of the two fighters could have come over in one round and gone to town. The psion could have turned his powers on the worgs. No one did. And the ranger goes down. What makes it worse is he had diehard, so when he went down, it was over.
The post mortem had the rest of the players apologizing to the player of the ranger. One of 'em turned to the ranger's player and said, "I'm sorry, I got carried away. With the goblins I was able to use cleave!" That kind of broke the sad mood and we got a good laugh at the end of the whole thing.
The Kender gets over there, but by then it's too late. The mage could have set himself up and lightning bolted both worgs. Either of the two fighters could have come over in one round and gone to town. The psion could have turned his powers on the worgs. No one did. And the ranger goes down. What makes it worse is he had diehard, so when he went down, it was over.
The post mortem had the rest of the players apologizing to the player of the ranger. One of 'em turned to the ranger's player and said, "I'm sorry, I got carried away. With the goblins I was able to use cleave!" That kind of broke the sad mood and we got a good laugh at the end of the whole thing.
BSF
Explorer
I can't really recall setting up PC deaths as a punishment. Though, I sometimes have the oddly malevolent giggle of putting something that is likely to kill a PC into a room. I mean, I know they are going to investigate the "item of doom", they are PC's right? But I'm not gunning for anyone in particular there, I'm just reminding them that being an adventurer is dangerous.
However, I kill NPC's for story reasons like I am eating candy. I have also prophesied the death of a PC from early on in the game and gone after the whole party at the end of a campaign. I'm actually thinking about writing that campaign up as a Story Hour just to get some practice. But, everyone is looking for examples, so I will give some.
PC: Ternell - Paladin of Pter. Good guy, low Int. Great player, who sometimes gets a little cocky.
Situation: Taking the PC down a notch & introducing a villian.
We had just finished up a decent Story Arc and I was starting to plan a new one. I remember being at my LGS and seeing the cover of a module that struck me as perfect for an NPC I had. I wish I could remember the name right now, but it was a girl in a dress with a bastard sword in the middle of an undead army, or that's how I remember seeing it.
Anyway, the party is coming back to their base city when they meet the local army riding down. It seems that an undead army is moving North and they are supposed to stop it. The PC's, being mostly good, offer to assist. The battle site is selected near a chapel of Pter. When the battle begins, the leader of the army lays out an idiotic battle plan that strings the army out in a long line with no mutual defense, no defense on the flanks, no hidden surprises, etc. (Yes, this was intentional on my part. The NPC was supposed to be less than brilliant.) Much chaos and death ensue up to the point where the PC's appear to be the last living combatants. They have used most of their spells, most of their turnings etc. They are on a low hill and surrounded when the undead stop fighting. Ranks part and a blond girl with a frilly white dress is walking up to the party. I believe I described her as 'cute as a button'. The PC cleric recognizes her as his long lost sister that he sometimes dreams about. She ridicules the party and calls out Ternell to single combat. She promises to 'kick his ass' and kiss him. She summons an imp to go get her a weapon.
Ternell wasn't too sure about this, but she promised to attack them all and kill them if he wouldn't come out to play. She also said a lot of disparaging things about him. He finally relented.
It was kind of a sad battle, she was buffed up the wazoo against him and had a 32 AC. She would literally dance around then attack once. The real insult came when she started striking for subdual. Ternell didn't even hit her once. It brought disbelief to his little 7th level face. She kissed him, knocked him down to the ground and then cut off his hand. The whole army left and she had the imp bring his hand along.
Storywise, it introduced a vilian that had some strong ties to the party. It also introduced a bunch of questions and the overreaching story arc for the campaign. The side affect of teaching the paladin PC that he wasn't quite as tough as he was starting to think was more a lesson that the PC's were not the top of the food chain at 7th level. It was fun for me and the players all enjoyed it, even Ternell's player.
PC: Ternell - High Knight of Pter (Homebrew PrC) Still a good guy with low Int. Player is still great and knows the campaign is ending. His prophecies are reaching culmination.
Situation: The party has to waken a slumbering god of Evil and Madness and evict it from the pseudo-dimenstional pocket that it sleeps in that ties it to the material plane and is basically the root of all Evil in the area. Ternell's god, Pter, has personally charged Ternell with making sure the god does not exit to the material plane. The evil god must leave by the other portal where Pter himself might have a chance to do battle with the god of evil.
I'm not going to go into all the details, but the battle was pretty grim. Even a tricked out PC is going to have a difficult time taking on a god. Ternell knew he was going to be sacrificing himself to, literally, save the world. He was OK with that, it's his job. The player knew it was coming up and was pretty sure Ternell would be dying. But, he had some hope that it might still work out so that Ternell could retire someday. I think the player had more hope than the PC did in-character. The battle was pretty much an effort to see how long the PC could hold off the god. Could the rest of the PC's seal the portal before Ternell died. It was close, but Ternell did not die for nothing.
Definitely an example of intentioanlly killing a PC.
However, I kill NPC's for story reasons like I am eating candy. I have also prophesied the death of a PC from early on in the game and gone after the whole party at the end of a campaign. I'm actually thinking about writing that campaign up as a Story Hour just to get some practice. But, everyone is looking for examples, so I will give some.
PC: Ternell - Paladin of Pter. Good guy, low Int. Great player, who sometimes gets a little cocky.
Situation: Taking the PC down a notch & introducing a villian.
We had just finished up a decent Story Arc and I was starting to plan a new one. I remember being at my LGS and seeing the cover of a module that struck me as perfect for an NPC I had. I wish I could remember the name right now, but it was a girl in a dress with a bastard sword in the middle of an undead army, or that's how I remember seeing it.
Anyway, the party is coming back to their base city when they meet the local army riding down. It seems that an undead army is moving North and they are supposed to stop it. The PC's, being mostly good, offer to assist. The battle site is selected near a chapel of Pter. When the battle begins, the leader of the army lays out an idiotic battle plan that strings the army out in a long line with no mutual defense, no defense on the flanks, no hidden surprises, etc. (Yes, this was intentional on my part. The NPC was supposed to be less than brilliant.) Much chaos and death ensue up to the point where the PC's appear to be the last living combatants. They have used most of their spells, most of their turnings etc. They are on a low hill and surrounded when the undead stop fighting. Ranks part and a blond girl with a frilly white dress is walking up to the party. I believe I described her as 'cute as a button'. The PC cleric recognizes her as his long lost sister that he sometimes dreams about. She ridicules the party and calls out Ternell to single combat. She promises to 'kick his ass' and kiss him. She summons an imp to go get her a weapon.
Ternell wasn't too sure about this, but she promised to attack them all and kill them if he wouldn't come out to play. She also said a lot of disparaging things about him. He finally relented.
It was kind of a sad battle, she was buffed up the wazoo against him and had a 32 AC. She would literally dance around then attack once. The real insult came when she started striking for subdual. Ternell didn't even hit her once. It brought disbelief to his little 7th level face. She kissed him, knocked him down to the ground and then cut off his hand. The whole army left and she had the imp bring his hand along.
Storywise, it introduced a vilian that had some strong ties to the party. It also introduced a bunch of questions and the overreaching story arc for the campaign. The side affect of teaching the paladin PC that he wasn't quite as tough as he was starting to think was more a lesson that the PC's were not the top of the food chain at 7th level. It was fun for me and the players all enjoyed it, even Ternell's player.
PC: Ternell - High Knight of Pter (Homebrew PrC) Still a good guy with low Int. Player is still great and knows the campaign is ending. His prophecies are reaching culmination.
Situation: The party has to waken a slumbering god of Evil and Madness and evict it from the pseudo-dimenstional pocket that it sleeps in that ties it to the material plane and is basically the root of all Evil in the area. Ternell's god, Pter, has personally charged Ternell with making sure the god does not exit to the material plane. The evil god must leave by the other portal where Pter himself might have a chance to do battle with the god of evil.
I'm not going to go into all the details, but the battle was pretty grim. Even a tricked out PC is going to have a difficult time taking on a god. Ternell knew he was going to be sacrificing himself to, literally, save the world. He was OK with that, it's his job. The player knew it was coming up and was pretty sure Ternell would be dying. But, he had some hope that it might still work out so that Ternell could retire someday. I think the player had more hope than the PC did in-character. The battle was pretty much an effort to see how long the PC could hold off the god. Could the rest of the PC's seal the portal before Ternell died. It was close, but Ternell did not die for nothing.
Definitely an example of intentioanlly killing a PC.
Epametheus
First Post
As a DM, I usually am not gunning for a particular PC, though I run fairly lethal battles. This is also much less of an issue at high levels, when Resurrection and True Resurrection enter the picture.
The one time I did gun for a PC, it was for in-character reasons; the party was having a rematch with a half-fiend super assassin (he was a 10/10 rogue assassin with a lot of unique abilities). The previous battle with Kas Patheos had ended in a draw, with both sides deciding that victory would have too high a cost. Nevertheless, Kas's erinyes consort had been slain with a Destruction spell in the previous battle, and so the set-up at the start of this rematch battle was very simple: if the cleric cast Invisiblity Purge at the start of the fight (she won over Kas in the initiative order), she would live. If she didn't cast it, she would die from 40d6+ sneak attack damage, on top of other things.
She didn't cast it.
I've actually seen more deaths from PvP than from DMvP (in the sense of the DM gunning for a particular character; I've seen plenty of deaths simply from really hard battles).
The one time I did gun for a PC, it was for in-character reasons; the party was having a rematch with a half-fiend super assassin (he was a 10/10 rogue assassin with a lot of unique abilities). The previous battle with Kas Patheos had ended in a draw, with both sides deciding that victory would have too high a cost. Nevertheless, Kas's erinyes consort had been slain with a Destruction spell in the previous battle, and so the set-up at the start of this rematch battle was very simple: if the cleric cast Invisiblity Purge at the start of the fight (she won over Kas in the initiative order), she would live. If she didn't cast it, she would die from 40d6+ sneak attack damage, on top of other things.
She didn't cast it.
I've actually seen more deaths from PvP than from DMvP (in the sense of the DM gunning for a particular character; I've seen plenty of deaths simply from really hard battles).
Stormborn
Explorer
(Admitedlly this is in a game using the Skull n Bones system of "lives" and no one had died yet.)
Once a player said: "I really feel like my character needs some come-upance."
Simply put the PC was a low level Bard with high CHA and a way with the ladies (even though played by a female.) She played the character true to her character concept, even when it meant doing things she, as a player, thought was a bad idea. She wanted an in game reason for him to change his life.
So, I set up a duel he couldn't win. Poisoned bullet, dishonest second. The NPC was going to hit, and was going to kill the Bard.
And thats what happened.
The Bard has a rather horrifically distrubing vision of the doorway to the after life in a Near Death Experiance, the other PCs spend a great deal of cash on medicine (because they had more than they needed at the time), and eventually the Bard changed direction.
Its what the player wanted, just not the way she wanted it to happen.
Once a player said: "I really feel like my character needs some come-upance."
Simply put the PC was a low level Bard with high CHA and a way with the ladies (even though played by a female.) She played the character true to her character concept, even when it meant doing things she, as a player, thought was a bad idea. She wanted an in game reason for him to change his life.
So, I set up a duel he couldn't win. Poisoned bullet, dishonest second. The NPC was going to hit, and was going to kill the Bard.
And thats what happened.
The Bard has a rather horrifically distrubing vision of the doorway to the after life in a Near Death Experiance, the other PCs spend a great deal of cash on medicine (because they had more than they needed at the time), and eventually the Bard changed direction.
Its what the player wanted, just not the way she wanted it to happen.
Derulbaskul
Adventurer
Yep, did it in my last session.
I just got tired of certain things with one particular player. He would not declare his character's actions unless and until he had an out-of-game conversation with one of the other players, despite the objections to such conversations expressed both by me as the DM and another player.
He was also offended that I asked him not to look up the DR vulnerabilities of a particular creature while fighting in a combat against these creatures after the group's Knowledge skill checks failed to come up with the answer.
So, yes, I killed one of his characters on purpose by fudging some rolls. It was the first time in 20+ years of DMing that I did it but I did. Of course, at 16th level this is only a temporary thing (otherwise I would not have done it) but it seemed to relieve me of the frustration that I was feeling.
Anyway, my confession is at an end. I'm feel somewhat absolved.
I just got tired of certain things with one particular player. He would not declare his character's actions unless and until he had an out-of-game conversation with one of the other players, despite the objections to such conversations expressed both by me as the DM and another player.
He was also offended that I asked him not to look up the DR vulnerabilities of a particular creature while fighting in a combat against these creatures after the group's Knowledge skill checks failed to come up with the answer.
So, yes, I killed one of his characters on purpose by fudging some rolls. It was the first time in 20+ years of DMing that I did it but I did. Of course, at 16th level this is only a temporary thing (otherwise I would not have done it) but it seemed to relieve me of the frustration that I was feeling.
Anyway, my confession is at an end. I'm feel somewhat absolved.
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