D&D 5E (2024) Heightein Spell and Innate Sorcery are Insane!

Lord Ustur

Explorer
I've been playing a few adventures and I see that with just a single metamagic I'm much stronger and more effective than any other caster... applying disadvantage to ALL saving throws and also increasing +1 DC (equivalent to +2 attribute) makes me incredibly effective and hard to beat.
I can name countless spells that are very effective with heightened spell but especially Heightened Counterspell is extremely strong to disable the enemy caster who is not proficient in saving throw and has a low con score. In the game this saved our party from several troubles
Sorcerers really are the most powerful today and for me who played this was clear as water.

What is your opinion on the subject?
 

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I've been playing a few adventures and I see that with just a single metamagic I'm much stronger and more effective than any other caster... applying disadvantage to ALL saving throws and also increasing +1 DC (equivalent to +2 attribute) makes me incredibly effective and hard to beat.
I can name countless spells that are very effective with heightened spell but especially Heightened Counterspell is extremely strong to disable the enemy caster who is not proficient in saving throw and has a low con score. In the game this saved our party from several troubles
Sorcerers really are the most powerful today and for me who played this was clear as water.

What is your opinion on the subject?
Sorcerers like power (pg. 33). Pretty expensive. Plus, you would ideally want to Subtle Counterspell as well, so even more expensive, at least until level 20. And the baddie keeps their spell slot. And your reaction is spent. And you’re relatively close to the baddies. My bard will be cheering him on from his Rope Trick pocket dimension. Go sorcerer!
 


while it sounds powerful in theory, and in some cases can save you, in effect you spend your 3rd level slot, 2 sorcery points and a reaction to negate one Action from enemy.

and it gets negated by 65ft of distance(not always possible).
 

while it sounds powerful in theory, and in some cases can save you, in effect you spend your 3rd level slot, 2 sorcery points and a reaction to negate one Action from enemy.

and it gets negated by 65ft of distance(not always possible).
Far from being a theory, I tested this in practice and it is stronger than it seems, this was just one of the cases.
But there are several other examples.
Heightein Telekinesis can restrain a Boss and pull them into your melee party. Heightein Hold Monster | Psychic Lance | Suggestion | Sleep | Banishment can nullify a powerful enemy. Careful + Heightein Fear / Hiptonic Pattern can literally change the game completely. Of course I am only mentioning one metamagic. 2 SP is not expensive. Remember that sorcerers can convert slots into SP and still recover SP in short rest and can still have items like Bloodwell Vial to help even more to regain SP
 
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Far from being a theory, I tested this in practice and it is stronger than it seems, this was just one of the cases.
But there are several other examples.
Heightein Telekinesis can restrain a Boss and pull them into your melee party. Heightein Hold Monster | Psychic Lance | Sleep | Banishment can nullify a powerful enemy. Careful + Heightein Fear / Hiptonic Pattern can literally change the game completely. Of course I am only mentioning one metamagic. 2 SP is not expensive. Remember that sorcerers can convert slots into SP and still recover SP in short rest and can still have items like Bloodwell Vial to help even more to regain SP
the problem is not heighten spell metamagic, it's the spell itself.
heighten spell is just a mathematical fix of a spell effect that can happen, maybe it moves the chance from 40% to 64% or from 80% to 96%, but it gives nothing new to the spell or more powerful to the spell.
you still need to count on the fact that the spell CAN take effect, no matter is it 40% or 80%.

real point is, do we need save or suck spells or do save or suck spells needs the save at all, just the effect? but shorter effect.
maybe 1 min duration can be 2 turns or 1 turn if creature have resistance to stun/charm/heroic resistance.
 

I've been playing a few adventures and I see that with just a single metamagic I'm much stronger and more effective than any other caster... applying disadvantage to ALL saving throws and also increasing +1 DC (equivalent to +2 attribute) makes me incredibly effective and hard to beat.
First, to clarify-- heighten spell applies disadvantage to ONE saving throw, even if multiple entities are making saves. So it decidedly increases the success-likelihood of a Counterspell, but only marginally increases the overall success of a well-used Fear, Hypnotic Pattern, or multi-target Hold Person (admittedly, if you were to use heighten spell on such a multi-target spell, you would give disadvantage to the target you most want to fail the save).

There are spells (single-target lockdown) where it is decidedly effective. It needs to be noted, however, that 1) situations where locking down a single target has great influence to the overall outcome are a subset of overall situations, and 2) -- those spells were already highly effective in those situations (Horwath is correct that it is simply moving the chance of success from X% to Y%).

Regardless, those are often clutch situations, so the ability is powerful. As it should be, given that metamagic is the biggest thing sorcerers get, and there are other options like Subtle, Careful, and Quicken that can fundamentally change when you would even consider casting a spell to begin with. Really it is metamagic abilities like empowered (switch 1s on damage rolls for avg 3.5 most of the time) that seem to underperform.

Innate sorcery is more interesting. In boss battles, its use seems clear, although at times the bonus action to invoke is a hard choice between other things people want to do round one. In other situations, I've tended to see people decide to use it about one round after it would have mattered.

Regardless, it actually matters one roll in 20 (or just a little more than that if we go by checks instead of rolls and dis/advantage is on the table). As the math thrown around every thread about ASIs/starting-at-16+ have shown, that's super-not-nothing. At the same time, for a game that can work with both rolled stats and point buy/array, we also know it's not the end-all and be-all. So again, the effect is powerful, but should be based on how much of the class features it represents.

In both cases, I don't see it making sorcerers "the most powerful today." It's an effective use of class abilities, full stop. And kudos to whomever played around with it and recognized that it was effective. But that's it. It makes effective strategies (which already would have been powerful) that much more so.
 

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