I'm really liking all the ideas thrown around here because I have the same issues about dropping to 0 hp. Gives me ideas I could use. Another issue that I have which may or may not be of concern to the OP is the problem of hp bloat in the higher levels which makes encounters much less deadly and just much more tedious. I don't know if the OP system would help with that or aggravated the issue.
D&D 5E Help me with this House Rule: Vitality Points & Staggered Condition [UPDATED]
Argyle King
Legend
Before responding, I want to clarify my understanding.
As I understand it, a staggered character is conscious. When a staggered character is stabilized, they fall unconscious.
Is that correct?
As I understand it, a staggered character is conscious. When a staggered character is stabilized, they fall unconscious.
Is that correct?
BookTenTiger
He / Him
1) yes
2) that is a part of the house rule I don't like. What is a better way to work in stabilizing that doesn't just copy healing 1 hp?
Argyle King
Legend
I'm trying to parse out the benefit of stabilizing someone during combat.
BookTenTiger
He / Him
I'm honestly not sure either, but I know there are abilities and spells that do so. They may just not have a use with these House Rules.
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
It would remove the staggered condition I would think.
But, this is the point: does stabilizing remove staggered or does removing staggered stabilize?
And what is the the downside to not stabilizing? How does the PC "get worse"? How do they get closer to dying?
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
Just throwing an idea out there for the day: what if you had to spend a HD to remain conscious when at 0 HP? Each time you take damage you have to spend another HD or fall unconscious maybe?
The use of HD could replace the idea of a Recovery Point (RP) I suggested earlier. The HD can keep you up and going in the fight or help you recovery (regain HP) while resting (short rest) as normal.
Just a thought...
The use of HD could replace the idea of a Recovery Point (RP) I suggested earlier. The HD can keep you up and going in the fight or help you recovery (regain HP) while resting (short rest) as normal.
Just a thought...
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Lanefan
Victoria Rules
On reading the first post I admit to seeing some holes; but as the thread's gone along many of them have been filled in.
The one thing I'd say is that these points - Vitality, Wound, whatever other name they end up with - should NOT scale with level or change as your Con fluctuates. You get 'em at 1st level (by whatever means) and they're locked in at that number for life*. This way, the player only ever has to worry about setting the number once. Con goes up? Down? Who cares, your VP/WP/whatever amount doesn't change.
High level characters already have scads of hit points, they don't need any more.
As for the starting amount: I wouldn't want to base it strictly on the PC's Con score as that would suddenly make Con the most important stat in the game. I'd rather see it based on either an average of some stats (say, "Your VP is equal to the average of your Wis, Con and Cha scores, dropping any fractions") or on something like "Your VP is equal to your third-highest starting stat score, regardless of which stat that score is in".
That said, were it me I'd also want some sort of minor randomizer in there because I don't like static numbers. Maybe as simple as: "Once you have determined your initial VP amount, roll a d6 once: 1 = -2 VP, 2 = -1 VP, 3-4 = no change, 5 = +1 VP, 6 = +2 VP. This modified number becomes your VP score and in most circumstances this will remain constant through your character's life."
For ease of management, I wouldn't bother having the recovery limit be any different than the full amount.
* - although I could see a real good argument for permanently reducing this number by one each time you are revived from death.
The one thing I'd say is that these points - Vitality, Wound, whatever other name they end up with - should NOT scale with level or change as your Con fluctuates. You get 'em at 1st level (by whatever means) and they're locked in at that number for life*. This way, the player only ever has to worry about setting the number once. Con goes up? Down? Who cares, your VP/WP/whatever amount doesn't change.
High level characters already have scads of hit points, they don't need any more.
As for the starting amount: I wouldn't want to base it strictly on the PC's Con score as that would suddenly make Con the most important stat in the game. I'd rather see it based on either an average of some stats (say, "Your VP is equal to the average of your Wis, Con and Cha scores, dropping any fractions") or on something like "Your VP is equal to your third-highest starting stat score, regardless of which stat that score is in".
That said, were it me I'd also want some sort of minor randomizer in there because I don't like static numbers. Maybe as simple as: "Once you have determined your initial VP amount, roll a d6 once: 1 = -2 VP, 2 = -1 VP, 3-4 = no change, 5 = +1 VP, 6 = +2 VP. This modified number becomes your VP score and in most circumstances this will remain constant through your character's life."
For ease of management, I wouldn't bother having the recovery limit be any different than the full amount.
* - although I could see a real good argument for permanently reducing this number by one each time you are revived from death.
toucanbuzz
No rule is inviolate
I go with Starting Hit Points and don't allow increases unless your CON score goes up. Admittedly, d6 characters can very easily get 1-shotted at 0hp, but I don't treat Vitality as a separate pool of hit points to absorb yet even more hits. It's death's door and you're about to step over.
Ultimately, the OP is on the right path, but the goofiness of Death Saves is how it handles damage. You can be knocked to 0 with a single attack, but when you're at 0hp, that same attack doesn't (in fact unless you've failed a death save or it is at least your max hp, can't) kill you.
BookTenTiger
He / Him
So last week we officially started playing with my variant Staggered and Wound Points. Here's how I wound up doing it:
At any time, a staggered character may choose to enter the unconscious condition. An unconscious character is still staggered, but might not be targeted by attacks from certain combatants. A character who falls unconscious suffers 1 level of exhaustion until they have rested for at least 10 minutes.
Staggered and Instant Death
Because a staggered character is at 0 Hit Points, they are especially susceptible to Instant Death, which occurs when the damage taken from a single attack or spell would reduce the character's hit points to a negative number equal to their Maximum Hit Points.
Wound Points represent how many deep, grievous wounds a character can suffer before dying. When a character reaches 0 Wound Points, they die.
Total Wound Points
A character has a number of Wound Points equal to their starting Hit Points. For example, a fighter (10 starting Hit Points) with a 14 Constitution (+2 Hit Points) would have a total of 12 Wound Points. A character's total number of Wound Points do not increase with level. However, if a character's Constitution bonus changes (due to Ability Score Improvements, magic items, or spell effects), their Wound Point Total changes as well.
Losing Wound Points
A character loses 1 Wound Point in the following situations:
Most magic that heals Hit Points does not heal Wound Points. Instead, a character recovers Wound Points through extended rest and downtime.
After a week of restful downtime, a character recovers Wound Points equal to half their Total Wound Points. Characters may complete Downtime Activities during this rest. However, if a character takes any damage to Wound Points during the week, they gain no benefits from the time they have already rested.
The spells Restoration and Greater Restoration do provide temporary Wound Points. Like temporary Hit Points, temporary Wound Points provide bonus Wound Points that must be reduced to 0 before the character takes any more damage to their base Wound Points. Temporary Wound Points do not stack.
When a character is reduced to 0 Wound Points, they die.
Returning from the Dead
Spells that return characters from the dead have the following effects:
So far, we've had a few Wound Points due to Critical Hits, but no one has been reduced to 0 HP. I wouldn't be surprised if even taking a few Wound Points encourages the group to take a week of downtime in the middle of this adventure, which I would love! It will give them time to bond with NPC's.
Staggered Condition
When a character reaches 0 Hit Points, they enter the Staggered Condition. When a character enters the Staggered Condition, they suffer the following effects:- They immediately take 1 damage to Wound Points.
- Any effects that cause damage instead cause the loss of 1 Wound Point.
- On their turn, the character may move, take an action, or take a bonus action. They may only choose one.
- Spellcasters cannot Concentrate on spells. Spells or effects currently being concentrated upon end their effect. Any new spells cast that require Concentration end their effect at the end of the spellcaster's turn.
- Staggered characters suffer 1 damage to Wound Points at the end of their turn.
At any time, a staggered character may choose to enter the unconscious condition. An unconscious character is still staggered, but might not be targeted by attacks from certain combatants. A character who falls unconscious suffers 1 level of exhaustion until they have rested for at least 10 minutes.
Staggered and Instant Death
Because a staggered character is at 0 Hit Points, they are especially susceptible to Instant Death, which occurs when the damage taken from a single attack or spell would reduce the character's hit points to a negative number equal to their Maximum Hit Points.
Wound Points
This house rule replaces Death Saving Throws.Wound Points represent how many deep, grievous wounds a character can suffer before dying. When a character reaches 0 Wound Points, they die.
Total Wound Points
A character has a number of Wound Points equal to their starting Hit Points. For example, a fighter (10 starting Hit Points) with a 14 Constitution (+2 Hit Points) would have a total of 12 Wound Points. A character's total number of Wound Points do not increase with level. However, if a character's Constitution bonus changes (due to Ability Score Improvements, magic items, or spell effects), their Wound Point Total changes as well.
Losing Wound Points
A character loses 1 Wound Point in the following situations:
- When struck by a Critical Hit.
- When entering the Staggered Condition.
- When they take damage while staggered.
- When ending a turn in the Staggered Condition.
Most magic that heals Hit Points does not heal Wound Points. Instead, a character recovers Wound Points through extended rest and downtime.
After a week of restful downtime, a character recovers Wound Points equal to half their Total Wound Points. Characters may complete Downtime Activities during this rest. However, if a character takes any damage to Wound Points during the week, they gain no benefits from the time they have already rested.
The spells Restoration and Greater Restoration do provide temporary Wound Points. Like temporary Hit Points, temporary Wound Points provide bonus Wound Points that must be reduced to 0 before the character takes any more damage to their base Wound Points. Temporary Wound Points do not stack.
- Restoration: 1 temporary Wound Point.
- Greater Restoration: 2 temporary Wound Points.
When a character is reduced to 0 Wound Points, they die.
Returning from the Dead
Spells that return characters from the dead have the following effects:
- Revivify, Raise Dead, Resurrection: The character regains half their total Wound Points.
- True Resurrection: The character regains all their lost Wound Points.
- Reincarnate: The new body starts with maximum Wound Points.
So far, we've had a few Wound Points due to Critical Hits, but no one has been reduced to 0 HP. I wouldn't be surprised if even taking a few Wound Points encourages the group to take a week of downtime in the middle of this adventure, which I would love! It will give them time to bond with NPC's.
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