Helpless doesn't Hinder

[Wolfwood2]

Last night I used 'Face of Death' (I think), a level 9 Wizard daily attack spell from Arcane Power. If you hit an opponent and they fail their first save, this imposes the 'Helpless' condition. Naturally I went in thinking this would be a really awesome power. Then I actually made an enemy Helpless and we looked up what the condition does.

Huh.

It grants combat advantage and makes all successful attacks from an adjacent foe into critical hits. And... that's it. It doesn't hinder the helpless creature from taking any action they otherwise normally would.

Is that it?

 

[Obryn]

If you ask me, a few auto-crits from your melee folks is kind of ... awesome.

-O

 

[Stalker0]

Its a weaker spell than sleep...but along with sleep the autocrits make this one of the most powerful spells in the game. My party was doing 100's of points of damage due to this spell.

 

[Obryn]

Its a weaker spell than sleep...but along with sleep the autocrits make this one of the most powerful spells in the game. My party was doing 100's of points of damage due to this spell.

Seriously. The greataxe-wielding Barbarian player in my game would call this a perfect moment to Avalanche Strike, doing ... let's see...

3[W]=36 +
13 (Str+Con+Magic) +
1d12 (high crit) +
2d6

= 1d12+2d6+49 damage, plus another 6 if he went into it bloodied.



-O

 

[Jack99]

It grants combat advantage and makes all successful attacks from an adjacent foe into critical hits. And... that's it. It doesn't hinder the helpless creature from taking any action they otherwise normally would.

Is that it?

A helpless creature can't take any actions.

 

[Wolfwood2]

If you ask me, a few auto-crits from your melee folks is kind of ... awesome.

I suppose the circumstances just weren't very favorable. It was a very high defense enemy, so even with combat advantage our guys had some trouble hitting. Both our strikers are ranged strikers, so less love there.

Still, it's one of those situations where the game rules cause cognitive dissonance. The guy is 'helpless' and we can perform coup de grace actions on him (and even kill him outright if one does damage equal to his bloodied value), but otherwise he can act normally? It feels like a situation not anticipated by the rules, that anyone would ever be helpless without being unconscious or otherwise completely restrained.

I guess it's still a pretty nifty power, because there are a lot of movement restrictions enemies can't evade. Sure is weird, though.

 

[Wolfwood2]

A helpless creature can't take any actions.

Here is what it says in the Compendium about being helpless.

• <H1 class=player>Helpless

• • You grant combat advantage.
  • You can be the target of a coup de grace.
  Note: Usually you’re helpless because you’re unconscious.

</H1>Not a blessed word about not taking actions.

 

[bganon]

A helpless creature can't take any actions.

Not according to the Player's Handbook.

 

[Zinovia]

I'd agree that a helpless character shouldn't be able to take any actions, but surprisingly enough, when I looked it up in the PH, it didn't say that.

HELPLESS
• You grant combat advantage.
• You can be the target of a coup de grace.
Note: Usually you're helpless because you're unconscious.

UNCONSCIOUS
• You're helpless.
• You take a -5 penalty to all defenses.
• You can't take actions.
• You fall prone, if possible.
• You can't flank an enemy.

Given that even Dazed means you can't flank an enemy and only get one action, it seems that Helpless ought to impose a worse restriction (no actions). It implies that, but doesn't state it clearly in that area of the book. Certainly the very word "helpless" means you can't do anything. So what *ought* it to say about that condition?

-edit-
I tried to add this immediately after my post, but the server ate it.

Should Helpless impose:
-5 penalty to all defenses?
Fall prone if possible?
You can't take any actions.
You can't flank an enemy.

I am strongly in favor of the last two, but uncertain about the others.

 

[Flipguarder]

By raw how the heck do you even describe helpless?

Your enemy stands there looking particularly easy to hurt only if you hit him. However, he's completely mobile, able to attack, and looks fairly comfortable otherwise.