D&D 5E Is the major thing that's disappointing about Sorcerers is the lack of sorcery point options?

[UnadvisedGoose445]

the only thing I really want added to the subclasses is to be able to decide how some things play out. And the dragon sorcerer should have options to not get scaley or winged, or be able to shift into a draconic humanoid form, and back to their normal appearance. So I can choose to just look unusually beautiful, instead of like a scaled, winged, elf creature.

I guess I just have a hard time understanding why this trips anyone up. If you look at the image of the Draconic sorcerer in the PHB, his scales are literally not noticeable. Playing it off as a slight magical glimmer, that only shows up when struck, is the easiest thing in the world. The point of the feature is free Mage Armor, and it is due to magical Draconic resilience. The wings are also retractable. So a Draconic sorcerer can, and probably usually does, look as normal as any other member of its race, with no indication otherwise, unless desired. At least 99.99% of the time.

Id even dig some racial origins. Heck, a whole supplement of racial subclasses, with the sorcerer one being a Paragon Origin, where you exemplify your race in a supernatural, almost exarch-ish way, and your magic comes from a sort of genetic memory.

This is a super cool idea, but probably a design nightmare lol.

 

[flametitan]

XP because there's no 'concede' button.

That said, you do make a good point about the relativity of magic based on setting. I don't think this is the best thread for that topic, though, but I wouldn't mind discussing that point again in the future.

Id even dig some racial origins. Heck, a whole supplement of racial subclasses, with the sorcerer one being a Paragon Origin, where you exemplify your race in a supernatural, almost exarch-ish way, and your magic comes from a sort of genetic memory.

That sounds interesting, though may be a nightmare to design. I'm generally a fan of universal subclasses, though, but I could see a Paragon sorcerer path, with generic abilities to enhance your racial abilities, though I don't know how I'd word them, yet. Like, perhaps an ability that enhances the innate spellcasting feature of certain races, or allows you to treat spells gained by your races as Sorcerer spells you know.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Does remixing the classes count as an edition fetish?

Well, if I get to define it, I guess not. The spikes thing in 3e was funny, there were a lot of 'spiked' this that and the other, but they tended, disproportionately to be optimal (for something) or break a general rule in an odd way or otherwise just get a little too much credit for what they were. The Spiked Chain is, of course, the earliest, most notorious example. In 4e, there were just a few too many feats and items that enhanced charging and powers that could be used in a charge - the infamous Fey Charger Build, until it was errata'd, was the culmination - it's probably why you can't Charge in 5e without an optional feat. In both cases, it wasn't obvious when the game first came out, though, in retrospect, it became so. 5e, better than two years in, is, in terms of number of supplements, still hovering around 'just came out.' :shrug:

Sorry for the digression, just a bit of humor.

 

[SkidAce]

Sorcerous Origin

Arcane Bloodline

At first level choose a school of magic, this will affect later abilities. You can also add any spell of that school to your list of available spells to be known.
You can speak, read, and write an arcane language of your choice, suitable to the campaign, or choose one of the elemental languages.
When dealing with magical lore and items, your prof bonus is doubled if it would apply.

Magic Resilience
As magic flows through your body, it causes the arcane traits of your ancestors to emerge. At 1st level, you gain 1 temp hit point per level after a long rest. Additionally, your body is protected by a magical field similar to mage armor. When you aren't wearing armor, your AC equals 11 + your Int modifier.

Arcane Affinity
At sixth level you gain the second level ability from the arcane tradition of the school you chose as your specialty.

Arcane Aura
At 14th level, you gain an aura of flight, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create this aura as a bonus action on your turn, and it lasts until you dismiss it as bonus action on your turn.

Arcane Presence
As Draconic Presence.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I agree that the racial sorcerer would be a huge time sink, at the least even if it were one subclass with features dependant on race, it would be multiple pages for one subclass.

Racial subclasses in general, though, I think can work fine. While I generally prefer general ones, I see no harm in also having specific concepts. Just make the features so that another race could use them, where possible, but I've no problem with a dwarves defender that uses and boosts dwarves racial features, or a draconic Paragon that gives a DB wings, dragonfear, or extended use of their breath weapon, etc.

some races might be best left as mechanically generic, though. I mean, bladesinger. It's an elf fighter/wizard thing, and it's nice that it's easy to just houserule away the racial restriction.


Anyway, I don't agree that warlocks don't feel like they're made of magic. Everything they do is magical. Not necessary spells using spell slots, but definately magical. To me, they seem just as magical as wizards or sorcerers. Just different. Which IMO, is how the sorcerer should have felt. Just as magical, but differently magical.

 

[MoonSong]

Sorcerous Origin

Arcane Bloodline

At first level choose a school of magic, this will affect later abilities. You can also add any spell of that school to your list of available spells to be known.
You can speak, read, and write an arcane language of your choice, suitable to the campaign, or choose one of the elemental languages.
When dealing with magical lore and items, your prof bonus is doubled if it would apply.

Magic Resilience
As magic flows through your body, it causes the arcane traits of your ancestors to emerge. At 1st level, you gain 1 temp hit point per level after a long rest. Additionally, your body is protected by a magical field similar to mage armor. When you aren't wearing armor, your AC equals 11 + your Int modifier.

Arcane Affinity
At sixth level you gain the second level ability from the arcane tradition of the school you chose as your specialty.

Arcane Aura
At 14th level, you gain an aura of flight, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create this aura as a bonus action on your turn, and it lasts until you dismiss it as bonus action on your turn.

Arcane Presence
As Draconic Presence.

Not too convinced. Lore and caring about schools is indeed a wizardly thing, not a sorcerous thing. I mean it is nice if you want scholarly flavor, but thi ne is far from a "generic" sorcerer.

 

[SkidAce]

Not too convinced. Lore and caring about schools is indeed a wizardly thing, not a sorcerous thing. I mean it is nice if you want scholarly flavor, but thi ne is far from a "generic" sorcerer.

Fair enough, although let me explain my intent.

Not scholarly, but a way to exhibit a natural bent, a talent, or an origin.

The sorcerer whose power is infused with Necromancy. Or Illusion. Not a learning, but a natural gift that those silly wizards had to study for years to gain similar abilities.

Was it the best solution?, apparently not, as it is not satisfying to you, whom it was kinda developed for.

Perhaps I will have the time to try harder on my next day off, see what can be done.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Fair enough, although let me explain my intent.

Not scholarly, but a way to exhibit a natural bent, a talent, or an origin.

The sorcerer whose power is infused with Necromancy. Or Illusion. Not a learning, but a natural gift that those silly wizards had to study for years to gain similar abilities.

Was it the best solution?, apparently not, as it is not satisfying to you, whom it was kinda developed for.

Perhaps I will have the time to try harder on my next day off, see what can be done.

Imo, even reworking those abilities and writing them out would help a bit.

 

[flametitan]

I agree that the racial sorcerer would be a huge time sink, at the least even if it were one subclass with features dependant on race, it would be multiple pages for one subclass.

Racial subclasses in general, though, I think can work fine. While I generally prefer general ones, I see no harm in also having specific concepts. Just make the features so that another race could use them, where possible, but I've no problem with a dwarves defender that uses and boosts dwarves racial features, or a draconic Paragon that gives a DB wings, dragonfear, or extended use of their breath weapon, etc.

some races might be best left as mechanically generic, though. I mean, bladesinger. It's an elf fighter/wizard thing, and it's nice that it's easy to just houserule away the racial restriction.

Indeed. I think as far as racially limited subclasses, it might be best to target as common of racial features as possible, so that the most races can be covered with as few subclasses. I starting with a subclass that allows you to treat your innate spellcasting as sorcerer spells would be a good starting point.

Anyway, I don't agree that warlocks don't feel like they're made of magic. Everything they do is magical. Not necessary spells using spell slots, but definately magical. To me, they seem just as magical as wizards or sorcerers. Just different. Which IMO, is how the sorcerer should have felt. Just as magical, but differently magical.

Suit yourself. I just prefer having that much more spell slots open to me at a given moment for "made of magic" classes, which is the key limiting factor of a warlock up until 11th level.

@MoonSong would a sorcerer subclass built around improving pre-existing sorcerer abilities (and perhaps combined with doctorbadwolf's idea of a subrace focused basis for sorcery) help for feeling generic? I know it doesn't solve the spell selection limitations, but I figure it's a start.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Fair enough. For me, the number of leveled spells at a given moment is less signifigent than the patron magic, getting spells back faster, and the invocation benefits. Getting leveled spells at will makes me feel like my character is innately magical.