D&D (2024) Lawful, Chaotic, and Neutral touched species.

[CreamCloud0]

I always find these attempts to redefine the terms to be missing the point. Folks are viewing from a lens of specificity instead of generality. The definition isnt the breakdown. YMMV.

i realise this, but the name of the term is the first and sometimes the only thing that some people learn about what defines an alignment before deciding they 'understand what it's all about', labelling them something a little less vunerable to personal and moral interpretation might still help overall, y'know all those 'chaotic is random' players or 'lawful characters can't disobey a law, from anywhere'

 

[payn]

i realise this, but the name of the term is the first and sometimes the only thing that some people learn about what defines an alignment before deciding they 'understand what it's all about', labelling them something a little less vunerable to personal and moral interpretation might still help overall, y'know all those 'chaotic is random' players or 'lawful characters can't disobey a law, from anywhere'

Yeap, but I think that poor goose is cooked.

 

[CreamCloud0]

Yeap, but I think that poor goose is cooked.

that doesn't mean we should just leave it in the oven to burn

sorry about torturing the metaphor

 

[Vaalingrade]

that doesn't mean we should just leave it in the oven to burn

Right. It should instead be ground into a high-protein slurry and sold as pet food.

 

[Mirrorrorrim]

In my current setting, even common civilized folk are usually taught that life and souls are sacred and immense sources of power, and that there are afterlives and Outer Planes based on alignments and moral values. They are told that the Material Plane is a sacred proving ground for souls, to prepare for their immortal purpose in the afterlife, and to die early is to die before reaching one's true potential, so striving to excel at their passions while alive is highly encouraged. Whether their passion is battle and they are destined to fight for their gods on exalted battlefields, or their passion is hospitality and they are destined to bake perfect hunnybutter cookies that reward other souls with heavenly delight, they all have purpose.

Everyone who is taught about religion and the Outer Planes is taught that Balance is paramount, though a person cannot usually reach perfect Balance themselves. Because of this, every alignment is taught as having a purpose, even evil, because evil provides the opposition to good, and causes discomfort that tests people and forces them to grow or wither. People who embrace evil are told, or convince themselves, that they will uiltimately have power in the afterlife. People who are not taught about religion, or don't believe in it, are in for rude awakening when they don't know what to expect upon death. Such wayward souls can be tricked into torment in the afterlife.

A baker may consider themselves true good (NG) and work towards bettering the world in the kindest way they know how, and a LE blackguard may sell their soul and become a purposeful villain, taking and commanding all they can to prove their power and earn rewards in both life and the eternal afterlife within the Nine Hells. The blackguard can defend his evil actions by stating he is a nemesis that challenges any "hero" which makes both of them aspire to greater power. He may not even kill a hero if he wins, just forcing that hero to increase their might and try again. After all, the villain needs powerful foes to test their own mettle against. This "Balance of Strife" is perceived by some to be a symbiotic engine of growing one's own strength, so non-murderous rivalries and vendettas are common among proud folk who oppose each other.

I made a choice to give all alignments purpose and opposition, so not everyone just wants to kill their opposition on sight. Corruption and redemption are very powerful motives in the world. A villain who kills a hero just sent that hero to a good afterlife and their just rewards. That can be a boon to their opposition, so corruption is a very valid alternate path to death. There are some who walk a peaceful path whose purpose is to help redeem their opposition, not just kill them, because what matters is alignment at death. If a villain is defeated, imprisoned, and reformed, that is a greater victory than just killing them and sending their soul to whatever underworldly afterlife they might be destined for.

Because of all this, I do like planetouched species (aasimar, tiefling, genasi, etc.), but those species are only empowered by their planetouched blood. Their alignment is not prescripted but because they still count as humanoids and have free will.

I don't like anything I've seen for "chaos"-touched bloodlines, and Slaad-blooded are a no-go. As a DM, I used slaad in my last campaign to such scary effect, that when one PC ascended to godhood in a new world, their one permanent change to the universe was that the Slaadi were no longer part of reality. It was that important to them that their scourge was removed from reality. So I will honor it. (Curses! But I have other tricks up my sleeve.)

So back to the TOPIC at hand! If I were inspired to create a Chaos-touched humanoid that suits my home campaign, I might create an altered reality humanoid that evolves daily in some way, maybe randomly based on a roll on a table for a special ability, or maybe based on potential need but it can never the same 2 days in a row. As for a visual, if you've ever seen those evolving AI images on TikTok, where the essence of a character is kept, but they continuously evolve through a dozen similar forms, it might look something like that. Not a true shapechanger like a changeling or a doppelganger, but a creature whose personal essence is slightly morphable. These humanoids would be of bloodlines of greater entities in "Limbo" who change as often as the landscape in that realm. As for the species name, the word "Changeling" is already taken, and I don't like "Morphling", but maybe something like Xaosi or Anarchim.

 

[Divine2021]

Entering this thread to point out that in DnD, Alignment systems are actually good and not bad.

 

[Tonguez]

Entering this thread to point out that in DnD, Alignment systems are actually good and not bad.

But are they lawful or chaotic?

 

[Tonguez]

In my current setting, even common civilized folk are usually taught that life and souls are sacred and immense sources of power, and that there are afterlives and Outer Planes based on alignments and moral values. They are told that the Material Plane is a sacred proving ground for souls, to prepare for their immortal purpose in the afterlife, and to die early is to die before reaching one's true potential, so striving to excel at their passions while alive is highly encouraged. Whether their passion is battle and they are destined to fight for their gods on exalted battlefields, or their passion is hospitality and they are destined to bake perfect hunnybutter cookies that reward other souls with heavenly delight, they all have purpose.

Everyone who is taught about religion and the Outer Planes is taught that Balance is paramount, though a person cannot usually reach perfect Balance themselves. Because of this, every alignment is taught as having a purpose, even evil, because evil provides the opposition to good, and causes discomfort that tests people and forces them to grow or wither. People who embrace evil are told, or convince themselves, that they will uiltimately have power in the afterlife. People who are not taught about religion, or don't believe in it, are in for rude awakening when they don't know what to expect upon death. Such wayward souls can be tricked into torment in the afterlife.

A baker may consider themselves true good (NG) and work towards bettering the world in the kindest way they know how, and a LE blackguard may sell their soul and become a purposeful villain, taking and commanding all they can to prove their power and earn rewards in both life and the eternal afterlife within the Nine Hells. The blackguard can defend his evil actions by stating he is a nemesis that challenges any "hero" which makes both of them aspire to greater power. He may not even kill a hero if he wins, just forcing that hero to increase their might and try again. After all, the villain needs powerful foes to test their own mettle against. This "Balance of Strife" is perceived by some to be a symbiotic engine of growing one's own strength, so non-murderous rivalries and vendettas are common among proud folk who oppose each other.

I made a choice to give all alignments purpose and opposition, so not everyone just wants to kill their opposition on sight. Corruption and redemption are very powerful motives in the world. A villain who kills a hero just sent that hero to a good afterlife and their just rewards. That can be a boon to their opposition, so corruption is a very valid alternate path to death. There are some who walk a peaceful path whose purpose is to help redeem their opposition, not just kill them, because what matters is alignment at death. If a villain is defeated, imprisoned, and reformed, that is a greater victory than just killing them and sending their soul to whatever underworldly afterlife they might be destined for.

reminds me of the Vald Tepes legend being linked to Bram Stokers Dracula. Vlad as Blackguard who uses his powers for vegeance against his nations enemy (which is a large dominant empire). Vlad is bloodthirsty and merciless, revelling in the slaughter of Turks. Yet in his own nation, his success against the enemy has made him a War Hero - so for the people of Wallachia, should he be considered good or evil?

So back to the TOPIC at hand! If I were inspired to create a Chaos-touched humanoid that suits my home campaign, I might create an altered reality humanoid that evolves daily in some way, maybe randomly based on a roll on a table for a special ability, or maybe based on potential need but it can never the same 2 days in a row. As for a visual, if you've ever seen those evolving AI images on TikTok, where the essence of a character is kept, but they continuously evolve through a dozen similar forms, it might look something like that. Not a true shapechanger like a changeling or a doppelganger, but a creature whose personal essence is slightly morphable. These humanoids would be of bloodlines of greater entities in "Limbo" who change as often as the landscape in that realm. As for the species name, the word "Changeling" is already taken, and I don't like "Morphling", but maybe something like Xaosi or Anarchim.

could be just the anarchim mame but my mind wemt to the biblical cherubim as living vcreatures with four wings and four faces: an ox, a man, a lion and an eagle. Maybe metamorphing Aardlings could be brought back as representative of Chaos

 

[Hriston]

in what ways would you distinguish a human fey-decendant from a half-elf? i get that elves aren't the only types of fey but...

Even though elves and half-elves have "Fey Ancestry", elves aren't fey. They're humanoids, which, to me, means they’re natives of the prime material plane. They were befriended by certain of the fey from early on in their history, which left an imprint on their culture and epigenetic expression, but they are not the same people.

For a literary distinction between a fey-touched human and a (non fey-touched) half-elf, I might look at Aragorn, son of Arathorn, versus Prince Imrahil of Dol Amroth. Legolas noticed Imrahil's elven ancestry at the meeting held in Aragorn's tent in Chapter 9 of Book 5 of the LotR, while many recognized Aragorn as the rightful king, possibly in part due to his divine lineage -- a sort of “divine right” made manifest through his descent from Melian the Maia.

Fey Ancestry grants resistance to charm which is a good start for a fey-touched humanoid, but to distinguish them from elves, I’d focus on other fey-like abilities like general magical resistance, ability to charm/put to sleep, ability to become invisible, etc. There are many, and you could take your pick I suppose.

ETA: Something like the sprite's Heart Sight would be a good trait for a fey-touched race, IMO.

 

[Hriston]

fair enough, although 5e seems to be moving away from the idea that all hybrids are half-human.

That's why I said "possibly" human. I think the concept needs to at least allow for human as the blank slate onto which the hybrid is grafted to be equivalent to tiefling and aasimar. Otherwise, if we're ruling human out, then I think we're talking about something else.

personally I’d look to the Inevitables as a source for Nirvana-touched Human - judges and enforcers of ineffable law, bound by the Mark of Justice. Modrons with the Axiomatic mind and weird mathmatical symmetry could be spun into something, and I suppose there are enough rogue modrons in the lore to use as a template.

These are all interesting ideas. Like I said, I'm not crazy about the construct aspect of modrons or their creations, but assuming its an aspect that players are interested in exploring, a lot could be done with it involving a human or humanoid bloodline infected with nanobots, for example.