D&D (2024) Limiting Short Rests to 2x/day

[Stalker0]

...but it's a fantasy game

My post was to people that believed a fixed number of short rests "wasn't believable". As you said, its fantasy. If you want infinite short rests, sure we can suspend disbelief. But adding in a limit is easy, as that is more like how things work in real life.

The thematics can work either way, so I ask what provides the better mechanic experience. I think very quick 2x per day short rests is the easiest way to balance classes and the game, and is as believable as anything else in the game.

 

[NaturalZero]

And it would be back to trying to use all your buttons as early as possible so you don't waste anything. Less than half an hour short rests would be a step back. Not forward.

Having a diverse set of buttons every fight is a lot more interesting than pushing the same basic attack or eldritch blast button over and over because half the party didn't want sit for a whole hour. Anything that moves us away from dailies that are too few at low level and way too plentiful at high level is strong step forward, IMO.

 

[Eubani]

As much a some may want mechanics to serve a narrative at the end of the day it is still a game that is being played, and that to must be served. Thus you get limits like x/day short rests or fighter abilities x/day uses. Sometimes it is just necessary to plaster over and move on, either that or scream at clouds like some.

 

[Tony Vargas]

From the PoV of just making a playable game, an arbitrary limit on short rests is OK. But, simply having per-encounter abilities would be better. And what we have: baroque short-rest-recharge you're not expected to take after every encounter (but there's no way to settle on one time requirement that'd actually make that happen at every table) is worse than either.

 

[tetrasodium]

Having a diverse set of buttons every fight is a lot more interesting than pushing the same basic attack or eldritch blast button over and over because half the party didn't want sit for a whole hour. Anything that moves us away from dailies that are too few at low level and way too plentiful at high level is strong step forward, IMO.

There are quite a few more levels than you are focusing on. The warlock has a diverse set of options to use every fight & they are capable of dumping then recovering the bulk of it's power every fight or two.

Do the 8-15 spells a warlock can choose to cast from the 2 3 or even 4 fourth & fifth level spell slots per short rest that a warlock has from level 7 on above & beyond bladelock ABRBEB & other invocations count as a "diverse set" of options? Does the warlock not start getting a "diverse set" of options until wizard sorcerer druid & cleric pretty much find their slot gains over warlock frozen when they start gaining 1:1level 4-9th level spells at pretty much the same rate as a warlock is getting arcanum slots on top of warlock growth in pact slots bladelock ABRBEB & so on when they are unquestionably exceeding their now junior peers across the table?

 

[DammitVictor]

Unlimited 10-15 minute short rests, but tie even magical healing to hit dice so the coffeelock can't just take a level in bandaid.

 

[mamba]

Or you need the short rest to restore fewer resources.

I am all for them just restoring HP / spending HD

The place where balance concerns arise is class abilities that recharge on a short rest

agreed, throw the whole recharge out, unfortunately they did not do that, so we will have to wait another 10 years or so to get a chance again

Still, these are not unsolvable problems.

given how the playtest went, that might be true in theory, but not in practice

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Having a diverse set of buttons every fight is a lot more interesting than pushing the same basic attack or eldritch blast button over and over because half the party didn't want sit for a whole hour. Anything that moves us away from dailies that are too few at low level and way too plentiful at high level is strong step forward, IMO.

I thought so too. But after experiencing this playstyle, I come to the opposite conclusion.

 

[Dausuul]

I was thinking that unlimited 5-minute Short Rests is an issue because at that rate, Short Rest becomes synonymous with "Encounter" abilities. But if you look at out of combat abilities, it completely impacts worldbuilding. A Tier 3 warlock can cast three 5th level spells slots every 5 minutes. They literally can say "I can do this all day."

Just using the current Warlock spell list and subclasses, without altering them for a rules update:

A Celestialock gets unlimited powerful healing.
A Feylock gets unlimited Plant Growth, better for a pastoral community than a druid.
A Daolock gets unlimited Wall of Stone for construction purposes.
A GOOlock gets unlimited divination-style spells and charms.
An Undeadlock gets unlimited Death Ward and Speak With Dead.
An Undyinglock also gets unlimited Contagion to ruin the world.

I can't be alone in my concerns about extrapolating how design impacts worldbuilding assumptions, as well as player shenanigans.

These are certainly issues that would need to be tackled, although, let's be honest -- many of these were a worldbuilding problem already with regular wizard-style casting. The 5-minute warlock just takes that problem and sticks a neon sign on it.

A simple solution for many of these would be to add a rule that spells cast with a warlock slot end when you finish a short rest -- even if their normal duration would be longer -- unless you immediately spend another slot to keep them going. It doesn't address all the issues, but it gets the worst ones.

 

[NaturalZero]

There are quite a few more levels than you are focusing on. The warlock has a diverse set of options to use every fight & they are capable of dumping then recovering the bulk of it's power every fight or two.

Do the 8-15 spells a warlock can choose to cast from the 2 3 or even 4 fourth & fifth level spell slots per short rest that a warlock has from level 7 on above & beyond bladelock ABRBEB & other invocations count as a "diverse set" of options? Does the warlock not start getting a "diverse set" of options until wizard sorcerer druid & cleric pretty much find their slot gains over warlock frozen when they start gaining 1:1level 4-9th level spells at pretty much the same rate as a warlock is getting arcanum slots on top of warlock growth in pact slots bladelock ABRBEB & so on when they are unquestionably exceeding their now junior peers across the table?

If your party doesn't want to short rest because they're too long, you get a whopping 2 spell slots for the whole day for most of the campaign (until level 11).

2 spells slot for a whole day.

At level 10.

At that level, there are almost no combat option spells you get from invocations that don't use those non-existent slots. You're effectively arguing that the warlock works great if he can recover his spell slots, which is my whole point.