D&D 5E New Death and Dying Rules

[Szatany]

Ultimately, I would prefer to have characters start with more hit points and die at 0. Then, I would like a module to make unconsciousness (as well as wounds, staggered, and similar effects) become a possible result of taking significant damage.

I've been thinking about a system like that. Warhammer 1st edition had something like this and it created a lot of tension for players.
So characters don't (can't) have negative HP. When someone drops to zero and there's any damage remaining, he then makes a d20 roll.
- if damage was less than 1/3 his total HP, he rolls on the table of 20 minor effects.
- if damage was between 1/3 and 2/3 of his total HP, he rolls on the table of 20 major effects.
- if damage was above 2/3 his total HP, he dies.

Minor effects consist of unconsciousness as well as a variety of temporary conditions, bleeding etc.
Major effects consist of broken bones, cut arms and legs, lost eyes etc. things that put characters out for months unless strong magic is administered.

 

[Rhenny]

I guess I just played for bad DMs, as villains, NPCs and monsters receiving healing was a pretty common occurrence in the games I've played in over my 30+ years of gaming. And, when I DM'd my 3.5E game, healing was tossed back & forth across the battlefield by both my bad guys and the PCs. Heck, in the penultimate battle of the campaign, the party's dwarf fighter died 3 times in one combat - getting hit with two Revivifies and a Miracle (5000xp to allow True Resurrection as Standard Action, instead of a 10 minute casting time) to get him back on his feet each time.

One of the things I disliked about 4E when I DM'd it was that the monsters did not have the same access to healing as the PCs. So, I often gave monsters and NPCs access to additional healing - so, if something granted 5 temp hit points or healed 5 hp of damage, I'd change it to 15 temp hit points or healing 15 or similar.

I wasn't a fan of easy healing for PCs and monsters. When PCs could use 2nd wind and regain hit points in combat, to me (DM), it felt as if it was much harder to challenge the PCs. I was always looking for ways to put them into situations where they would expend the surge; therefore, I would have to throw tougher opponents at them in nearly every encounter. This helped to increase the time it took to play out each encounter (1-2 hour combats). The time problem was exacerbated when monsters had access to healing surges.

I like limiting healing in D&DNext. But, for death and dying, I like negative hit points and the chance to get worse, stabilize or revive to 1 hp (earlier playtest package rules).

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

I've been thinking about a system like that. Warhammer 1st edition had something like this and it created a lot of tension for players.
So characters don't (can't) have negative HP. When someone drops to zero and there's any damage remaining, he then makes a d20 roll.
- if damage was less than 1/3 his total HP, he rolls on the table of 20 minor effects.
- if damage was between 1/3 and 2/3 of his total HP, he rolls on the table of 20 major effects.
- if damage was above 2/3 his total HP, he dies.

Minor effects consist of unconsciousness as well as a variety of temporary conditions, bleeding etc.
Major effects consist of broken bones, cut arms and legs, lost eyes etc. things that put characters out for months unless strong magic is administered.

I ran a house rule once where taking damage in excess of your Con required a massive damage save. If you failed, you received an effect based on the type of damage dealt. Bleeding for slashing damage, unconscious for bludgeoning, and so forth. It went over rather well. The only challenge is that it doesn't scale at all, so almost every attack at high level would trigger a save.

 

[Szatany]

I ran a house rule once where taking damage in excess of your Con required a massive damage save. If you failed, you received an effect based on the type of damage dealt. Bleeding for slashing damage, unconscious for bludgeoning, and so forth. It went over rather well. The only challenge is that it doesn't scale at all, so almost every attack at high level would trigger a save.

That's why my proposal is tied to HP, that way it scales with level.

 

[NewJeffCT]

I've been thinking about a system like that. Warhammer 1st edition had something like this and it created a lot of tension for players.
So characters don't (can't) have negative HP. When someone drops to zero and there's any damage remaining, he then makes a d20 roll.
- if damage was less than 1/3 his total HP, he rolls on the table of 20 minor effects.
- if damage was between 1/3 and 2/3 of his total HP, he rolls on the table of 20 major effects.
- if damage was above 2/3 his total HP, he dies.

Minor effects consist of unconsciousness as well as a variety of temporary conditions, bleeding etc.
Major effects consist of broken bones, cut arms and legs, lost eyes etc. things that put characters out for months unless strong magic is administered.

We played with a pretty harsh critical hit system in 2E days. So, if you took a critical hit (a natural 20 or any single hit over 12 pts of damage), the DM would role on a critical hit table dependent on bludgeoning, slashing or piercing weapons. There were also modifiers for size, if I recall - so, a large creature like an ogre hitting a medium sized human would be a + to the table, while a small halfling hitting that same ogre would be a minus. However, about 2/3 of the way through my first campaign, nearly every PC had been hit with some sort of permanent injury - horrible scar, -1 to CHA; finger severed, -1 to DEX; etc. - but, these sorts of permanent, or semi-permanent debilitating injuries were a lot tougher on the PCs, since the monsters and/or villains would rarely survive beyond that first encounter.

Similarly, with the Warhammer system, while appealing on its surface, if the PC is out of action for a month or two in a time sensitive campaign, you're either going to have idle PCs, or else you're going to have to give the players access to healing magic that allows them to get back in the game.

 

[NewJeffCT]

I wasn't a fan of easy healing for PCs and monsters. When PCs could use 2nd wind and regain hit points in combat, to me (DM), it felt as if it was much harder to challenge the PCs. I was always looking for ways to put them into situations where they would expend the surge; therefore, I would have to throw tougher opponents at them in nearly every encounter. This helped to increase the time it took to play out each encounter (1-2 hour combats). The time problem was exacerbated when monsters had access to healing surges.

I like limiting healing in D&DNext. But, for death and dying, I like negative hit points and the chance to get worse, stabilize or revive to 1 hp (earlier playtest package rules).

I don't mind limited healing at all, especially at lower levels. But, when the aforementioned 3.5E campaign got to high levels, I didn't want the players to feel like I was holding back as a DM - so, hitting them with Finger of Death, Slay Living, Destruction, Disintegrate, etc, right at the start of the combat was pretty common, as the PCs were facing a cabal of evil clerics and wizards. So, without good access to healing, I also took the risk of killing a PC in round 1 and then having them out of combat for the rest of the night. (though, the time I hit the party barbarian with a Maze spell, it was a high-five around the table moment for the group when she rolled a natural 20 for her INT check, and popped out of the Maze the next round...) With 8 players and a few NPCs on the players' side, and the clerics, wizards and their support on the other, combats often took most of the night.

 

[Szatany]

Similarly, with the Warhammer system, while appealing on its surface, if the PC is out of action for a month or two in a time sensitive campaign, you're either going to have idle PCs, or else you're going to have to give the players access to healing magic that allows them to get back in the game.

I think spells would be the anwser in the magic-rich worlds of D&D. Both existing ones like regeneration and perhaps new ones like a spell allowing to ignore wounds for 1 day for example.

 

[pemerton]

If we assume that magic will be used to make serious wounds go away, what is the point of the mechanical overhead required to generate and track them? Verisimilitude?

 

[Szatany]

If we assume that magic will be used to make serious wounds go away, what is the point of the mechanical overhead required to generate and track them? Verisimilitude?

I do want spells that remove wounds, but I don't want each such case to be easy. If a low level character can't afford casting of regeneration, he will probably have to go on a quest for the cleric or get some serious money quickly. Either way I see potential here.

 

[NewJeffCT]

If we assume that magic will be used to make serious wounds go away, what is the point of the mechanical overhead required to generate and track them? Verisimilitude?

Well, the original intent of 5E was to have "dials" where you could change things depending on your style of play - maybe in a low magic setting, you need hit points, but when you dial up the amount of available magic, it's not quite as necessary. Plus, even with a higher magic setting, there may be times or places where the players don't have access to healing magic, especially at low levels.