Order of the Stick: How long will they put up with Miko?

[MavrickWeirdo]

People love to bring this up. But when the DM cheats, the game loses all fun. Instead of the characters doing stuff, it become Dm fiat. The game loses all sense of danger, or uncertainty, and ceases to be a game, or even a challenge. It just becomes "lots of people watching a DM tell them what happened". There is no exhiliration when the DM cheats so you don't die, or when the DM cheats so that the party is captured at just the right time. It isn't heroic to succeed when the dice are fudged in your favor, or fudged so something that would have been easy becomes difficult. There is just tedium.

But OotS isn't actually a game. It is a story where 1 person controls all the characters (even Belker). I understand that if a story is "too contrived" then it can ruin the "suspension of disbelief", however this particular story is a parody. The situations in it are Intentionally contrived, as in

Miko: Wait-You are serious? That is your actual explanation? "My evil twin did it"?

Roy: Yeah, I know. I find it's best not to fight the madness.

 

[Bullgrit]

Mostly the reason why people are picking this apart is that it is clear that Miko, the DM, cheated. And that's where you lose a lot of people. The DM isn't supposed to cheat. Not in your game, not in mine, and not in the OotS game either. But he did, and from our perspective, it's just busted all the credibility behind the story. Now the OotS wins when the DM decides they win and not a moment before. It's no longer about how the Order goes through their adventures and be interesting characters and fight a lich. It's now about them just being dragged along through the plot like tourists, since it's been shown that they now have absolutely no control over their destinies.

Um, they've shown in the past that they are knowingly following a script. Hell, we've seen them actually holding the script in their hands. They've mentioned "hackneyed plot device", "something special for the 100th episode", "just like a Vin Diesel movie", "end of the trade paperback", etc. "Stupid railroad plot," is right in line with what we've seen throughout the whole OotS run.

Rich Burlew's "explanation" in that message board thread? Completely irrelevant to the comic's story. His battle description doesn't affect the comic at all. All it does is give people something to pick apart -- and that's why he doesn't give any other concrete information on the characters (levels, feats, etc.) People will stop enjoying the comic so they can pick it apart.

Geez.

Bullgrit

 

[IcyCool]

Nope. The strip will become far less interesting if the Miko tangent ends soon. Without the ability to make decisions the OotS will become objectively dull.

To you. I still find it quite entertaining.

 

[The_Warlock]

Playing in your campaign would be pure tedium for me. Standing in the splotlight is only fun if you put yourself there. Having a DM prop you up by fiat is just boring. If you run a race and come in fourth, but I decide by fiat that you should get the first place medal, how much fun is that? How rewarded do you feel getting an accolade you don't really deserve? How much fun is it for characters to get into the spotlight when they know the DM made sure things worked out that way?

And how would you know? I never said I don't let the PCs make their choices, I never said I don't let them fail. Nor do I always let them succeed. Their choices and their dice make the calls. But as the DM, the final arbiter of the world and its rules, I use rules or ignore rules when the PCs and THEIR story are paramount. I don't kill PCs out of hand to make a point, nor make them invulnerable to failure and death. But I won't allow rules and my dice rolls to come between them and the choices and stories they make. But if that's not your style, no problem, it's no skin off my nose.

And I guess that's my point, you are saying (if I understand correctly) that in OotS, Mr. Burlew is falling back on tired plot device of railroading to continue his story. I say he is using parody and sarcasm to show the problems inherent in the tired plot device of railroading. Which is why I continue to be entertained by his comic, where his characters routinely call out the very failings in any story (RPG or otherwise) when they fall victim to them. Thus, humor is born.

EDIT: And there are Bullgrit and MaverickWeirdo pointing out the essential parody nature. I really need to use smaller words and shorter paragraphs. People keep beating me to my points. chuckle

 

[Storm Raven]

But OotS isn't actually a game. It is a story where 1 person controls all the characters (even Belker). I understand that if a story is "too contrived" then it can ruin the "suspension of disbelief", however this particular story is a parody. The situations in it are Intentionally contrived, as in

Sure, but parodying a railroad campaign is almost as dull as an actual railroad campaign. Without the ability to make silly, smart, or stupid choices, or choices driven by odd rules applications, you lose a lot of OotS. Being led around by the nose by Miko makes for a dull strip.

 

[Falkus]

Nope. The strip will become far less interesting if the Miko tangent ends soon. Without the ability to make decisions the OotS will become objectively dull.

I'm scheduled to write an essay on strategic issues in a few days. I was wondering if you could let me know what my opinion on the middle east situation was?

 

[Storm Raven]

To you. I still find it quite entertaining.

No you don't. You find it dull. Isn't railroading fun?

 

[DreadPirateMurphy]

Ok everybody, let's take a time out and relax. Breath. Good.

Our favorite comic writer probably made a mistake in trying to "justify" his plot line. He doesn't usually do that, and this is precisely why. It is why Joss Whedon doesn't try to justify how fast his spaceships go.

I am positive that:

1) There is a plot line planned out for OoTS that will be interesting and entertaining.
2) Miko will get her comeuppance at some point.
3) The OoTS will get out of this situation, just like when they were all hanging from nooses in the bandit camp.

Just accept the jokes about obnoxious paladins and railroad plots for what they are, and admit that Rich should have just kept mum on the combat sequence "justification."

Also note that if the characters in any story don't get into trouble, then you don't get to hear the entertaining part -- how they eventually get out of trouble.

Also remember that the reason any of you care is that you really like OoTS, and you identify with the characters and don't want unfair things to happen to them (like that is ever an option in the real world).

And as for typical player behavior: Storm Raven, your campaign has a town basically cut off from the outside world, and the party's primary patron is slowly dying without access to more powerful magic. My character, at least, has family he is trying to reach elsewhere. So naturally, the party is charging after breaking the blockade, right? Oh, wait, we're actually going on a monster hunt in what looks like a side quest...LOL. Talk about quasi-metagaming -- we want treasure and XP, so we naturally assume we're going to poke our head into any hole where it could get chopped off, and the order doesn't really matter.

 

[iwatt]

Nope. The strip will become far less interesting if the Miko tangent ends soon. Without the ability to make decisions the OotS will become objectively dull.

Objectively?

care to elaborate?

 

[IcyCool]

No you don't. You find it dull. Isn't railroading fun?

Your attempt to prove your point has failed. Mainly due to the fact that I'm not playing a character in your game.

If I were, and the railroad plot was entertaining, I'd have no problem going along with it.