Order of the Stick: How long will they put up with Miko?

[Lonely Tylenol]

But what about the comedic value inherent in someone saying "you'll have to drag us there in chains", and then having them all being dragged there in chains in the next panel?

That joke was old when they did it on Hogan's Heroes.

 

[Storm Raven]

Oh, and just to tweek some people, it is, in fact, the DM's job to Cheat, often, and well, to maintain a good story. The rules are a framework, but behind the screen, DMs should work an alchemy to make the game and the story fun, exhilarating, and heroic for the players. If that means cheating, for or against the PCs, to give the story the edge and make the PCs the center of that story in which they are the focus of their choices and destiny, then so be it.

People love to bring this up. But when the DM cheats, the game loses all fun. Instead of the characters doing stuff, it become Dm fiat. The game loses all sense of danger, or uncertainty, and ceases to be a game, or even a challenge. It just becomes "lots of people watching a DM tell them what happened". There is no exhiliration when the DM cheats so you don't die, or when the DM cheats so that the party is captured at just the right time. It isn't heroic to succeed when the dice are fudged in your favor, or fudged so something that would have been easy becomes difficult. There is just tedium.

 

[Henry]

That joke was old when they did it on Hogan's Heroes.

And the number of people reading OoTS who even know what Hogan's Heroes is these days probably pretty small.

I can't wait for Friday's comic myself. And, in another shot of hubris and pride, today's strip was the FIRST ONE WHERE I UNDERSTOOD WHAT HALEY WAS SAYING! It takes the old noggin' a while to warm up, but it's rewarding when it does.

 

[iwatt]

And I'll let you in on a little secret. It's not the D&D jokes that keep people coming back.

Really? It's good to know that I've been wrong all this time :\

For me it is the D&D jokes. It's not the "story". It's not even the characters (except for Belkar )

and for all those saying "Durkon is a Traitor". Isn't it possible he's just confused. He isn't the sharpest tool in the shed, and remember he's convinced that Thor was involved with Miko's arrival.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

People love to bring this up. But when the DM cheats, the game loses all fun. Instead of the characters doing stuff, it become Dm fiat. The game loses all sense of danger, or uncertainty, and ceases to be a game, or even a challenge. It just becomes "lots of people watching a DM tell them what happened". There is no exhiliration when the DM cheats so you don't die, or when the DM cheats so that the party is captured at just the right time. It isn't heroic to succeed when the dice are fudged in your favor, or fudged so something that would have been easy becomes difficult. There is just tedium.

Agreed. I play a role-playing game so that my decisions and luck can determine what happens to my character. I read a book if I want someone to tell me a story. I hate it when a DM mistakes an RPG for a storybook. I want control over the outcome of an RPG, using my character to exert that control. Taking that control away from me means I'm no longer playing. I might as well go do something else and have the DM email me what happens to my character, since it's his decision what happens no matter what I choose to do.

 

[The_Warlock]

People love to bring this up. But when the DM cheats, the game loses all fun. Instead of the characters doing stuff, it become Dm fiat. The game loses all sense of danger, or uncertainty, and ceases to be a game, or even a challenge. It just becomes "lots of people watching a DM tell them what happened". There is no exhiliration when the Dm cheats so you don't die, or when the Dm cheats so that the party is captured at just the right time. There is just tedium.

And I disagree, if the PCs come up with a novel approach to a situation which should have no chance by the RULES as written, I'm going to change those rules to give them a chance. If a villain has actually stirred the player's into playing the emotions of their characters, building up a great well of vengeance, justice, or pity bringing all to a climactic battle/confrontation, I'm going to make him live through 5 rounds to build the tension even if the saving through said he would die in round 1 in a spectacular anti-climax. If as a DM, I cheat, it's not to take away the victory or the defeat of the PCs, but make them stand in the spotlight. To make the players, and their characters, choices real and effective, no matter what a book of rules may say.

Now, that's not what Mr. Burlew is doing, since really, we are talking about OotS. He's showing a railroad plot. The character dialogue confirms it. He's showing the inconsistency of a ramshackle campaign. One where the universe is populated as much by rules-lawyers as keystone cops. The universe cheated not to put the PCs in the spotlight but because it couldn't find a new plot. I've seen those DMs, great storytellers, but can't finish an adventure, much less a campaign if the PCs make a decision other than the one the DM wanted. I'm enjoying the strip because I am looking at the fiasco that becomes from the outside, and waiting to see what wackiness is used to break free of it, or at least deter it. Which is a hell of a lot better than the runs I've really been in with DMs who couldn't RESPOND to character choices.

But that's me...

 

[The_Warlock]

I can't wait for Friday's comic myself.

I'm with you Henry!

 

[Storm Raven]

And I disagree, if the PCs come up with a novel approach to a situation which should have no chance by the RULES as written, I'm going to change those rules to give them a chance. If a villain has actually stirred the player's into playing the emotions of their characters, building up a great well of vengeance, justice, or pity bringing all to a climactic battle/confrontation, I'm going to make him live through 5 rounds to build the tension even if the saving through said he would die in round 1 in a spectacular anti-climax. If as a DM, I cheat, it's not to take away the victory or the defeat of the PCs, but make them stand in the spotlight. To make the players, and their characters, choices real and effective, no matter what a book of rules may say.

Playing in your campaign would be pure tedium for me. Standing in the splotlight is only fun if you put yourself there. Having a DM prop you up by fiat is just boring. If you run a race and come in fourth, but I decide by fiat that you should get the first place medal, how much fun is that? How rewarded do you feel getting an accolade you don't really deserve? How much fun is it for characters to get into the spotlight when they know the DM made sure things worked out that way?

Now, that's not what Mr. Burlew is doing, since really, we are talking about OotS. He's showing a railroad plot. The character dialogue confirms it. He's showing the inconsistency of a ramshackle campaign. One where the universe is populated as much by rules-lawyers as keystone cops. The universe cheated not to put the PCs in the spotlight but because it couldn't find a new plot. I've seen those DMs, great storytellers, but can't finish an adventure, much less a campaign if the PCs make a decision other than the one the DM wanted. I'm enjoying the strip because I am looking at the fiasco that becomes from the outside, and waiting to see what wackiness is used to break free of it, or at least deter it. Which is a hell of a lot better than the runs I've really been in with DMs who couldn't RESPOND to character choices.

Yes, it is what he is doing. And it is tedious. Much of the fun of OotS is the choices made by the members of the party - both smart and stupid. Railroading them takes that away from the strip, much to its detriment. Unless this "railroaded by Miko" tangent ends quickly, the strip will lose much of what makes it interesting.

 

[iwatt]

Unless this "railroaded by Miko" tangent ends quickly, the strip will lose much of what makes it interesting to me.

Edited your post.

Could you please stop generalizing. Clearly there are enough people who think the comic hasn't lost what makes it interesting.

 

[Storm Raven]

Edited your post.

No thanks.

Could you please stop generalizing. Clearly there are enough people who think the comic hasn't lost what makes it interesting.

Nope. The strip will become far less interesting if the Miko tangent ends soon. Without the ability to make decisions the OotS will become objectively dull.