Out of Healing Surges - what now?

[Obryn]

I'm sorry, where in the thread did we come to understand that he "made bad decisions"? Because I don't see it in any of the OP's posts at all, only as an assumption in a couple of posts by others.

Indeed the OP specifically states that "bad luck and encounters" caused the situation, rather than poor choices on the part of the character....

I think that blaming the player (without evidence or consideration) and calling him a "whiner" and so on is precisely the sort of monkey business that leads to role-players having a bad reputation as social performers....

Holy overreaction, Batman!

-O

 

[wolff96]

Homebrew:
- Find a "Symbol of CLW" (functions as a wand, but uses CLW for its power)
- Create a magic item called a "Symbol of Healing" or something, that has a similar effect

I would really recommend either:
A) Not doing this.
B) Making the CLW a daily power that uses a player's item activation uses as usual.

The module I'm running is a 3.5 conversion of a 1st lvl module. It's a murder mystery. The writer recognized the deadliness of 1st lvl in 3.5 especially in this situation, and put Cure Light Wounds potions everywhere. Perhaps I can emulate something similar, and have players regain healing surges slowly as they discover evidence of the plot - sort of a "okay, we're getting closer, let's keep pushing on". I think this emulates the 'HP aren't just wounds' quite a bit.

Maybe I'm crazy here, but aren't there still potions that heal 10 HP in the PHB? Why can't you just hand out several potions if you're worried about his survival? It might break the 'treasure parcel' idea a bit, but if your options are player death, introducing a potentially overpowered home-brew item, and breaking the treasure system a bit... well, I would advise going for the last option.

 

[Fobok]

Maybe I'm crazy here, but aren't there still potions that heal 10 HP in the PHB? Why can't you just hand out several potions if you're worried about his survival?

Since those potions require healing surges to work. They're basically just there to give you access to healing surges when there's no cleric or warlord about, I'm pretty sure.

 

[Lizard]

I started my 4th Edition game on Friday, and as we came to a close, one of the players announced he was out of healing surges, and that they should rest for the day.

Problem is, they're not in a situation where resting is really possible. They're stuck in a extremely hostile environment (edit: There's a time limit kind of thing too). Also, all of the other party members have a number of surges left.

What? You mean the game is STILL CHALLENGING?

Alert WOTC. Someone in playtest screwed up. There should be a recall of the books.

Seriously...what's the problem? Resource management has always been a large part of the D&D experience. So is pushing on when there's limited time and the party is drained. Either he hangs back, or, gasp, he acts heroic and risks death to accomplish a worthy goal.

 

[Tervin]

From the little clues I think I know exactly what it is you are playing. I actually considered using exactly that story to start off a 4th edition campaign myself. Couldn't make it fit with the next step of the storyline, so I skipped it in the end.

In that story I think the best solution is to let the NPC Paladin help with a few Lay on Hands when needed. (Fudge his Wisdom so that he has a couple more than he should.) There is clearly no way to take an extended rest, or even to run away to save a life. And, as healing potions need surges to work, the built in way to handle the long time without rest doesn't really work. You can even let the Paladin be multiclassed into cleric to get the CLW prayer...

Depending on how you made your conversion and DM style the players could be getting close to the next level and you could let them level in the middle of the night (which I don't really like normally, but in this story I might go for it). If you get them up to level 2, your player can pick Durable as a feat.

I don't think giving out homebrewed items that might be too powerful in the long run is a good solution.

 

[2eBladeSinger]

What is the role of the character in question? How long (how many encounters) do the players have to go before they are going to be able to rest? Do they have to face the (a) BBEG before this?

I’m assuming that the encounters are designed appropriately (i.e. that there are just a few balanced encounters between extended rests) and that the DM is not putting the characters through the wringer without any additional support and that the character’s lack of surges is from a bout of rotten luck rather than incompetence. (The reason I mention this is because, personally, I feel, as a DM, it is my duty to punish player incompetence and reward cleverness – I don’t like letting players just ‘win’).

Why don’t you just make note of the character’s HP and make sure that the hits he takes don’t drop him to zero. Call out hits against him as one point less his AC over and over again. Nickel and Dime him for three or four HP at a time. There’s nothing wrong with making him sweat a little, as his limited HP – and threshold of death gets closer and closer. Of course, if you feel a ‘hard fix’ is in order, introduce a MI with a defensive buff… then remind the player as he’s being attacked “if it weren’t for the strange amulet/shield/thingamajig you found in the bottom of that puddle, you might already be dead.

Of course, it kind of depends on the character’s role and quest outline, this is why I ask.

 

[Kaffis]

Are you building in milestones? Perhaps you could give the beleaguered player the option to take an extra healing surge instead of an action point? I wouldn't introduce this as a general house rule, probably, but as a tool to aid conversion of a heavily potion-balanced module, it would probably be okay.

 

[jelmore]

(The reason I mention this is because, personally, I feel, as a DM, it is my duty to punish player incompetence and reward cleverness – I don’t like letting players just ‘win’).

I agree; in my current gaming group I have to bite my tongue both as a player and as a DM to keep from telling a couple of our younger players that their obviously stupid ideas are such (charging into combat without healing or waiting for backup is a popular one), and instead let their PCs suffer the consequences. They're already "damaged" from being exposed to D&D through Neverwinter Nights -- they want to rest after every combat and loot everything that isn't nailed down...

But at the same time...

Call out hits against him as one point less his AC over and over again. Nickel and Dime him for three or four HP at a time. There’s nothing wrong with making him sweat a little, as his limited HP – and threshold of death gets closer and closer.

This can make for a memorable session, with the nervous player sweating "his" fate and the other players trying to help him make it to the end.

 

[Kraydak]

...
Why don’t you just make note of the character’s HP and make sure that the hits he takes don’t drop him to zero. Call out hits against him as one point less his AC over and over again. Nickel and Dime him for three or four HP at a time. There’s nothing wrong with making him sweat a little, as his limited HP – and threshold of death gets closer and closer....

This is probably the worst possible option. If you are tempted by this, just flat out state that there is a problem with the adventure design (due to edition differences) and give out a free extended rest. Honesty is a DM's best friend. DM fudging is both far more obvious than most DMs think and it leaves a bad taste in players' mouths.

Out of curiosity, why *can't* the party leave/wait? Remember, mission failure *is* usually an option.

 

[baberg]

I'd like a little more information about how this character came to be out of healing surges while the rest of the group is just fine. Were the monsters "picking on" him? If he's a Defender, did he make poor choices for feats and stats? If he's not a Defender, does he rush into combat without thinking about the consequences? Or is it just bad luck that he has had 5 ongoing damage for 10 rounds because his saving throw keeps failing?

If he's been making bad decisions, then tough love is called for. His character dies. You've said this is just the first adventure - it should be simple to reroll.