Unearthed Arcana Poll: How will the US Class Feature Variants be brought to Market?

[LuisCarlos17f]

What is this? a half beholder half othyug drow werewolf?

That was the totemist, a new class from "Magic of the incarnum".

Here you have an excerpt from the book.

Magic of Incarnum Excerpt

Magic of Incarnum Excerpt

archive.wizards.com

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Good way to boost sales for a Setting book, honestly.

An even better way to lose the good will of your customers. Not everyone wants a setting book. How do you think players who only ever play homebrew will feel about being FORCED to buy a setting book in order to access core rules, including the beastmaster fix?!

 

[Parmandur]

An even better way to lose the good will of your customers. Not everyone wants a setting book. How do you think players who only ever play homebrew will feel about being FORCED to buy a setting book in order to access core rules, including the beastmaster fix?!

As Crawford goes into, these are not "Core Rules," these are options that are meant to be balanced with the PHB options. Their goal for the final product is that two Rangers can be in the same party, one using the PHB material, one using these options, and not have it make a difference to gameplay balance. If they aren't quite at that balance in this document, that is their stated goal for the final product.

There are already rules in the Setting books that require they be purchased (or parts purchased on Beyond), such as the Group Patrons, the Artificer Class, extended magic items rules, the extended faction material in Ravnica, etc. If the book is, for instance, Planescape, that shouldn't be a major concern since the tables that use Homebrew and buy books tend to stick with the core cosmology (that's why they assume the cosmology in the Adventures). A bunch of new player options, and a bunch of Planar monsters, is sufficient to entice a significant number of people. The philosophy they developed for Xanathar's Guide, which served them well, was to make books that don't appeal entirely to targeted groups of people, but have enough for a larger audience to want enough of the material to buy it.

Anyways, time will tell: but apparently we are done with material for the existing Classes now, so the new product has a robust but fairly contained section on Classes.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

As Crawford goes into, these are not "Core Rules," these are options that are meant to be balanced with the PHB options.

I think any claim that the ranger changes are not "core rules" will be met with the derision it deserves.

There are already rules in the Setting books that require they be purchased (or parts purchased on Beyond), such as the Group Patrons, the Artificer Class, extended magic items rules, the extended faction material in Ravnica, etc. If the book is, for instance, Planescape, that shouldn't be a major concern since the tables that use Homebrew and buy books tend to stick with the core cosmology (that's why they assume the cosmology in the Adventures).

I'm guessing that you are someone who like campaign settings, irrespective of if you intend to use them or not, and therefore do not empathise with that great many people who will see something labelled a campaign setting and therefore refuse to buy it, even if it does contain something they can use. As with Ravnica, the only thing people actually wanted was the spore druid, but they didn't want it so much that they could afford to spend £30 of their limited funds on a hardback full of stuff they don't want, so they got angry instead.

If WotC want to keep their customers (at least those who don't have unlimited funds and unlimited shelf space) sweet they need to republish the subclasses from Ravnica and the spells from the Sword Coast book in a general rule book.

We get that you want a setting book. No one is saying there won't be a setting book in 2020 as well as a general rule book.

 

[Parmandur]

I think any claim that the ranger changes are not "core rules" will be met with the derision it deserves.



I'm guessing that you are someone who like campaign settings, irrespective of if you intend to use them or not, and therefore do not empathise with that great many people who will see something labelled a campaign setting and therefore refuse to buy it, even if it does contain something they can use. As with Ravnica, the only thing people actually wanted was the spore druid, but they didn't want it so much that they could afford to spend £30 of their limited funds on a hardback full of stuff they don't want, so they got angry instead.

If WotC want to keep their customers (at least those who don't have unlimited funds and unlimited shelf space) sweet they need to republish the subclasses from Ravnica and the spells from the Sword Coast book in a general rule book.

We get that you want a setting book. No one is saying there won't be a setting book in 2020 as well as a general rule book.

I do not mean to invalidate your feelings, but Ravnica was a big success for WotC. The Subclasses may or may not be in future books, but it isn't particularly clear that "people" are mad about it, or that the Class material was all that "people" wanted, since the book sold like hot cakes.

The more important point right now is, we have ~34 pages of materials, much of which might not make it into a book, and no new PC options in the pipeline for this round of testing. Whatever the product is, it is not going to be as option heavy as XGtE. The closest equivalent we have so far is the Setting books: this is more in line with SCAG for page count.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I do not mean to invalidate your feelings, but Ravnica was a big success for WotC.

Something can be successful in the short turm, but still piss off customers and be harmful in the long term.

The Subclasses may or may not be in future books, but it isn't particularly clear that "people" are mad about it, or that the Class material was all that "people" wanted, since the book sold like hot cakes.

I can tell you for a fact that there are people in this category.

The more important point right now is, we have ~34 pages of materials, much of which might not make it into a book, and no new PC options in the pipeline for this round of testing. Whatever the product is, it is not going to be as option heavy as XGtE.

You are mistaken. For content we can have:

• The UA subclasses
• The Ravnica subclasses
• Bladesinger and Battlerager (clarified and with more spiked gear options) from SCAG
• Spells from SCAG
• Artificer from Eberron, plus the Archivist subclass
• The current bunch of modified and optional rules
• mass combat rules
• vehicle rules
• sidekick rules (expanded with more animals)
• The next couple of months UA content
• fluff-heavy content that doesn't need testing

That's plenty of content to assemble a Xanthar's sized book.

 

[Parmandur]

I can tell you for a fact that there are people in this category.

How many? Several, sure, many, maybe. Wizards would know, not us.

That's plenty of content to assemble a Xanthar's sized book.

We don't know what content may or may not be coming in further UA, though apparently it isn't Subclasses or further player variants. I agree that there might be plenty of "fluff"-heavy content, probably the majority of any given book. Hence, Setting book. Time will tell.

 

[OB1]

@OB1 I wanted dto apologize if I came off as grouchy about the PHB extension idea before: I don't think it will happen, ever, but I'm sorry for being a bit forceful about it.

In the bee YouTube videos today from D&D Beyond interviewing Jeremy Crawford, he wanted to emphasize that these options are not Errata to the PHB, and are designed with the purpose of not supplanting them, and being useable alongside each other. The way he talked made it sound very much like this is all for a book. What's more, he indicated that they are done with Subclasses for the time being, and that the variant options cap off the PC rules on existing Classes for the purposes of whatever product is in the works. Given that, and the small amount of rules tested in terms of page count (the words per page match what is in the printed books, though art will extend it slightly, we are still talking a fraction of a book). I'm still leaning heavily towards Setting book.

No worries @Parmandur I certainly know that I was advocating for a long shot possibility that would have reflected a major shift in just how far WotC is willing to push it's evergreen strategy.
I saw the notes on the Crawford interview, and unless he's being deliberately cagey, agree that a setting book is the most likely place these rules will appear. Crossing my fingers that it's a Guide to the Multiverse/Planescape/Spelljammer mash up, as I've been waiting for that since day 1 of 5e.
Could see the rules being introduced something like this, "Throughout the Multiverse, the classic archetypes of adventurers come in many variations. The following list of options, when permitted by your DM, reflect some of those possibilities."

 

[Yaarel]

@Paul Farquhar

That WotC could compile all of the scattered character options into a single book (or a single pdf), seems plausible.

It makes the Core +1 rule remain viable.

Also, they clearly want these options to be freely available to all players, but without changing the Players Handbook itself. A compilation can achieve both goals.

 

[Parmandur]

No worries @Parmandur I certainly know that I was advocating for a long shot possibility that would have reflected a major shift in just how far WotC is willing to push it's evergreen strategy.
I saw the notes on the Crawford interview, and unless he's being deliberately cagey, agree that a setting book is the most likely place these rules will appear. Crossing my fingers that it's a Guide to the Multiverse/Planescape/Spelljammer mash up, as I've been waiting for that since day 1 of 5e.
Could see the rules being introduced something like this, "Throughout the Multiverse, the classic archetypes of adventurers come in many variations. The following list of options, when permitted by your DM, reflect some of those possibilities."

That last sentence feels like it should be read by Orson Welles in announcer mode.

A Planar guide would be sweet.