Rain of Steel = being hit by an attack

[Flipguarder]

I'd also like to point out, although I understand that this is NOT the mark of a good dm, that also ruled this way simply because the monster he was attacking was the leader, AND that for the entire campaign (7 sessions or so) where he's had this daily the entire time, he's been telling me the damage was 1 [W] + str modifier damage. I had just found out during the same session that this was not true and was rather peeved with him.

Also the last session in the campaign where I am a PC and he's the DM he told me in the middle of me fighting a necrotic treant and 2 wights that about 4 rounds into the fight "oh, and 4 more wights show up and you are now surrounded" He then proceeded to attack me until all 17 of my healing surges were gone from the wight attacks and made me go unconscious.
He claims that they were there the entire time, but I call bunk on that (we were not using a battlemat for some god-forsaken reason.

 

[DracoSuave]

Yep. It's just like being in the line of fire on Cleave. You neither attack nor hit (nor miss, for that matter) nor target the additional target, so it won't trigger anything that relies on any of those conditions.

-O

Corrected for accuracy

 

[eriktheguy]

Oh man, if it counted as an attack then you would mark every adjacent enemy at the beginning of their turn. Luckily this isn't the case, and reign of steel is just very, very good rather than completely OP .

 

[HP Dreadnought]

Yes, Rain of Steel is not an attack, its an effect. As another poster pointed out, considering it an attack breaks it in a couple ways.

1st - Anybody starting next to the fighter becomes marked at the start of their turn if the fighter wishes.

2nd - Feats that add to opportunity attack damage (I forget the name of the one I am thinking about) would add MORE damage to this already potent power. The power does reference opportunity attacks, so therefore if you consider it an attack, that is the form it would take.

No. . you can not use an ability in reaction to "being attacked" against Rain of Steel.

 

[Blackbrrd]

I'd also like to point out, although I understand that this is NOT the mark of a good dm, that also ruled this way simply because the monster he was attacking was the leader, AND that for the entire campaign (7 sessions or so) where he's had this daily the entire time, he's been telling me the damage was 1 [W] + str modifier damage. I had just found out during the same session that this was not true and was rather peeved with him.

Also the last session in the campaign where I am a PC and he's the DM he told me in the middle of me fighting a necrotic treant and 2 wights that about 4 rounds into the fight "oh, and 4 more wights show up and you are now surrounded" He then proceeded to attack me until all 17 of my healing surges were gone from the wight attacks and made me go unconscious.
He claims that they were there the entire time, but I call bunk on that (we were not using a battlemat for some god-forsaken reason.

It seems you and your friend have an issue. You should talk with him about it.

Having rain of steel do +str too much damage isn't the end of the world, and he won't be doing it again.

Having wights show up in the middle of the fight did not make the game fun in any way for you. Having DMs change encounters arbitrarily mid-way seldom makes for any fun.

(I sometimes fudge the total hp of mobs if I have made an encounter too hard, but that shouldn't be too noticeable)

 

[Flipguarder]

Yeah we did talk about it. Turns out I was fairly bitter about it... lol. It all good now.

 

[Dr_Sage]

Yep. It's not an Interrupt triggered by "you take damage", it's an Interrupt triggered by "hit by an attack".

No attack roll => no hit.

Cheers, -- N

Yes, I use attack roll as a reference as well. Actually if a fighter gets to attack roll everyone with rain of steel he should be able to mark them as well (obviously not the writers intention).

The way I see is is - like dito above -its like an aura power. Remmember that aura is just a game term, it does not mean magic (remmember the rat swarm? Or the drake swarm? Just bites all around).

 

[DracoSuave]

Actually, you should use -hit- as the reference.

It's an important difference.

 

[Nifft]

You neither attack nor hit (nor miss, for that matter) nor target the additional target

Corrected for accuracy

(emphasis yours)

You do not target the target?

I think I see what you're going for, but that's a rather unclear way to phrase it.

I'd say something like: "The creature who suffers this effect is not a target of the power."

Cheers, -- N

 

[fuzzlewump]

To Markn,

Immobilized in 4E doesn't mean paralyzed, or else it would have the same effects as being helpless. It just means you can't move from your space, so possibly so slow that in 6+ seconds you can't move from your square, your legs won't respond due to magic disruption, restraint, etc.

Being pushed off a beam and rolling with the blow seems perfectly okay to me, because it is the outside force (the ray) being applied that allows him to 'roll with it' (use acrobatics.) Similarly, if you immobilize someone on an earth-like world, they won't stay in one place while the planet and all of its inhabitants hurtle onward through space, thus putting the immobilized person into space and killing him/her. Because of the force of gravity is a force acting upon the PC from the outside, like the pushing ray.

My realism break happens with the bard spell "misguided mark," as while it is magic the description doesn't really imply damage being done, but it can be used to bloody and kill enemies none the less. It's untyped damage, unfortunately, as psychic damage would have saved it for me, but oh well; I'll just pretend it's psychic damage and move on.