Ranged Sneak Attack While Hidden

[Rethalgamon]

Are enemies considered flat-footed -or- denied their dex bonus to AC against a hidden character? I've a wicked idea for a sniper rogue.

 

[Vegepygmy]

Are enemies considered flat-footed -or- denied their dex bonus to AC against a hidden character?

That depends. They're flat-footed if they haven't yet acted in combat. So if combat hasn't begun, and the hidden character is attacking in a surprise round, for example, the enemy is going to be flat-footed.

Also, a hidden character is effectively invisible. So unless the enemy has some ability that prevents it from losing its Dex bonus to AC against an invisible attacker (like blindsight), yes, it's going to be denied its Dex bonus to AC.

 

[javcs]

If the enemy you're shooting at failed it's spot/listen checks to notice you, and lacks some special sense to locate you (blindsense/blindsight, tremorsense, the like) (counterable via Darkstalker) or is otherwise unaware of your position, then, assuming it can be flat-footed, it is. Bear in mind, however, that after shooting, you're hiding at a -20, which will make it nearly impossible at low levels, and then at higher level it fades to merely difficult to unlikely against attentive opponents.

 

[irdeggman]

Rules Compendium pg 92

If you've successfully hidden with respect to another creature, that creature is flat-footed with respect to you. That creature treats you as if you were invisibile ((see page 76)

Rules Compendium pg 76

An attacker gains a +2 bonus on attack tolls against opponetns that can't see it. Opponents are denied their Dexterity bonuses to AC against an invisible attacker's attacks.

So not only are they considered flat-footed with respect to you (doesn't have a lot of meaning except at the beginning of combat, but they are denied their Dex Bonus to AC (hence you can sneak attack them) and you get a +2 bonus on attacks.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Rules Compendium pg 92

As an aside, it is really disappointing that the Rules Compendium misuses "flat-footed." That distinction has been hashed out for years.

 

[billd91]

As an aside, it is really disappointing that the Rules Compendium misuses "flat-footed." That distinction has been hashed out for years.

I agree. Saying that the hidden character is effectively invisible was sufficient for the purpose of the sneak attack.
I suppose they might have been implying that the flatfooted character wouldn't be able to get an AoO against a hidden character unless he had combat reflexes... that is, assuming that the attack revealed the hidden character with a new spot check (likely) AND the previously hidden character then took a move action or something to provoke an AoO...
I guess.

 

[Kask]

As an aside, it is really disappointing that the Rules Compendium misuses "flat-footed." That distinction has been hashed out for years.

There are many reasons to take what's written in the RC with a chunk of salt.
None of the groups I play with use it anyway.

 

[irdeggman]

There are many reasons to take what's written in the RC with a chunk of salt.
None of the groups I play with use it anyway.

Which is fine, but it is the rules authority to use and it does take precedence over any other pre-existing rules.

So not using it is just like deciding to not use parts of the PHB, MM or DMG. Fine and acceptable to do, but not RAW.

 

[Kask]

So not using it is just like deciding to not use parts of the PHB, MM or DMG. Fine and acceptable to do, but not RAW.

Not really. You need the PHB, DMG & MM to really play. You don't need the RC... Thus despite WotC saying it was the senior source (in order to boost rev in between editions) it makes zero sense as it doesn't replace those books.

 

[Vegepygmy]

Not really. You need the PHB, DMG & MM to really play. You don't need the RC... Thus despite WotC saying it was the senior source (in order to boost rev in between editions) it makes zero sense as it doesn't replace those books.

Your argument makes zero sense. Errata doesn't replace the core books, either (nor do you need it to play), but it is obviously the more definitive authority.