D&D General "Red Orc" American Indians and "Yellow Orc" Mongolians in D&D

[Ruin Explorer]

Redoing old legacy products is attempting to do exactly that.

No-one has suggested that except people arguing against the idea. I didn't suggest it. Nor did @Dungeonosophy as far as I know (maybe I missed something).

So that's not the argument.

 

[Zardnaar]

No-one has suggested that except people arguing against the idea. I didn't suggest it. Nor did @Dungeonosophy as far as I know (maybe I missed something).

So that's not the argument.

They suggested they should bring in a team and redo the product removing problematic parts if it and the original post more or less said they needed to do it across multiple products.

 

[Zardnaar]

Apparently Wizards/Hasbro does view itself as an educational institution. On the GAZ10: Orcs of Thar product page, Wizards/Hasbro states:

"Dungeons & Dragons teaches that diversity is a strength, and we strive to make our D&D products as welcoming and inclusive as possible."

D&D is apparently here to teach us.

My university had all sorts if things there that's offensive. Mein Kampf, Greek and Roman classics, various religious literature.

See where I'm going with this?

 

[Dungeonosophy]

You did:



To find each such legacy product, they have to comb through every legacy product to find all those instances.

Hi Mirtek, I suggested that Wizards tap a small team of professional/expert cultural consultants to comb through (=read through) GAZ10, and write a report of their findings of "ethnic, racial, and gender prejudice", and present those findings as an amendatory article on DRAGON+. And then to continue this process with other legacy titles. Wizards already has a network of such cultural consultants.

I've never said anything about "redoing" (=rewriting) the product. Zardnaar falsely "recapped" the amends process which I presented, and then called this strawman (which he himself invented) "cultural vandalism." See his words:

(Post #222):

"Dear WotC please hire a team to comb though every product ever and redo it".

Not sure if you're aware of how much work that [redoing/rewriting] actually entails.

They produce what 5 books a year? At its height TSR was cranking out 60 iirc.

Movie studios with vastly more amounts of money don't do that [=redo/re-write a work] and it's cultural vandalism as well."

***
And after I specifically called on Zardnaar to stop misrpresentating what I presented, he continued on, in three later posts:

(Post #278):
"Redoing old legacy products is attempting to do exactly that.

There's a lot of cringey products from the 80's. It's not really viable to redo them."

***
(Post #279):

"They're not gonna spend much time and effort redoing old obscure material from the 80's that probably doesn't sell that well anyway. [...]

People aren't going to redo it because it's a reflection of when it was created."

***
(Post #282):

"They [=Dungeonosophy] suggested they should bring in a team and redo the product removing problematic parts[.]"

***
That's a lie.

I repeat: Zardnaar, please stop falsely stating that I've suggested that GAZ10 or any legacy product be "redone / rewritten" or that I've ever suggested that legacy products be "expurgated."

 

[J.Quondam]

They suggested they should bring in a team and redo the product removing problematic parts if it and the original post more or less said they needed to do it across multiple products.

No, he didn't, not once in this whole thread. He's talking about examining old products and addressing problematic issues with the affected peoples; not "redoing" any old products.

edit: Ah, I see Dugeonosophy has replied on his own behalf.

 

[Zardnaar]

Hi Mirtek, I suggested that Wizards tap a small team of professional/expert cultural consultants to comb through (=read through) GAZ10, and write a report of their findings of "ethnic, racial, and gender prejudice", and present those findings as an amendatory article on DRAGON+. And then to continue this process with other legacy titles. Wizards already has a network of such cultural consultants.

I've never said anything about "redoing" (=rewriting) the product. Zardnaar falsely "recapped" the amends process which I presented, and then called this strawman (which he himself invented) "cultural vandalism." See his words:

"Dear WotC please hire a team to comb though every product ever and redo it".

Not sure if you're aware of how much work that [redoing/rewriting] actually entails.

They produce what 5 books a year? At its height TSR was cranking out 60 iirc.

Movie studios with vastly more amounts of money don't do that [=redo/re-write a work] and it's cultural vandalism as well."

They're not gonna do that and as I said they want to use D+ to promote 5E.
Your idea isn't really reasonable.

It's also open ended Orcs of Thar today what's next?

WotC doesn't need to apologize either they didn't make it that company that did is dead the people who made it long gone and in some cases dead.

They did inherit it so they might stop selling it.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

They suggested they should bring in a team and redo the product removing problematic parts if it and the original post more or less said they needed to do it across multiple products.

Can you quote that? I cannot see that in any of @Dungeonosophy's posts.

I think when you go check you'll find you misread it, and are actually remembering one of the responses to his post, which said, not his post.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

My university had all sorts if things there that's offensive. Mein Kampf, Greek and Roman classics, various religious literature.

See where I'm going with this?

That you think your university owns the IP for Mein Kampf and is selling copies of it digitally on a website?! It's very hard to see where you're going with this lol.

 

[Zardnaar]

No, he didn't, not once in this whole thread. He's talking about examining and addressing issues, not "redoing" any old products.

edit: Ah, I see Dugeonosophy has replied on his own behalf!

Can you quote that? I cannot see that in any of @Dungeonosophy's posts.

I think when you go check you'll find you misread it, and are actually remembering one of the responses to his post, which said, not his post.

Point. I don't think their idea is reasonable though. Pragmatically it's not gonna happen and by that I mean WotC won't spend the money to do that and comb through legacy product they didn't create. And they won't use D+ for what they're suggesting.

 

[Zardnaar]

That you think your university owns the IP for Mein Kampf and is selling copies of it digitally on a website?! It's very hard to see where you're going with this lol.

No but it's an example of bad ideas still in print. Orcs of Thar isn't in print but you can get a pdf if it more or less in it's original form.