D&D 5E RIP alignment

[Flamestrike]

Mike Ermantrout and Frank Castle are LE because they live by a code, respect honor, family and tradition, but are prepared to engage in pitiless murder, torture and harming others.

Darth Vader and Rick Sanchez are CE because they're reckless, unpredictable, have no code, and engage in murder, torture and harming others (including actual genocide).

Superman and Jon Snow are LG because they believe in family, honour and tradition, are altruistic and merciful, prepared to self sacrifice and they reject harming others unless it's in self defence or the defence of others.

Anakin Skywalker (pre fall) and Jessica Jones are CG because they are reckless, impulsive and unpredictable, but also altruistic and self sacrificing and avoid harming others unless in self defence or the defence of others.

Judge Dredd and Lucius Vorenus are LN because they believe in a strict code, and respect honor and tradition, but do not repudiate harming others, nor are committed to altruism.

Deadpool and Jack Sparrow are CN because they're unpredictable and reckless and untrustworthy. They lack the conviction to avoid harming others, but lack the altruism to make them good people.

For alignment changes in fiction look at Vader (CG to CE) Arya Stark (CG to NE), and Raistlin Majere (CN to CE).

Are we really still confused on this point?

 

[Maxperson]

Ok, so what does it tell you? And which of these things are important to the gnolls specifically?

It tells me that gnolls are not just violent, but pretty crazy violent. Might makes right, so if the PCs want to try and negotiate they need to do so from a position of strength and power that the gnolls understand. It tells me that the gnolls are very likely to honor any agreements that they might make. It tells me that if the PCs are weak, the gnolls will crush them or enslave them without mercy. It tells me that weak gnolls are very rare, as they would have been killed for their weakness long ago. And more.

On top of that, I get to add in the gnoll lore around the vague alignment edges to personalize the CE to gnolls.

I get almost none of that from your little blurb.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Let me just add why I think it’s better to get rid of default alignments for mundane humanoids, and why I prefer simpler alignment than 9. For every “listing LE helps me quickly identify X”, there are a dozen “hey man, I was just playing my alignment”

it’s also more encompassing to get rid of default alignment. Contrary to the inaccurate argument that keeps being made, in 1e, especially early 1e, alignments weren’t suggestions. They were literally defined as inherent in the MM. so while yes, technically one could override that, you had to override a core part of the game’s assumptions to do so. And the rules lawyers came in force. “What do you mean my detect evil didnt detect those orcs? Orcs are evil?”

Having inherent alignments are more restrictive because you’re telling people they shouldn’t play with different alignments to keep with how you’re expected to play the game. Whereas if you don’t have a default alignment, you’re telling EVERYONE they can have whatever alignment they want, including all orcs being evil.

 

[loverdrive]

It tells me that gnolls are not just violent, but pretty crazy violent. Might makes right, so if the PCs want to try and negotiate they need to do so from a position of strength and power that the gnolls understand. It tells me that the gnolls are very likely to honor any agreements that they might make. It tells me that if the PCs are weak, the gnolls will crush them or enslave them without mercy. It tells me that weak gnolls are very rare, as they would have been killed for their weakness long ago. And more.

Is it really because of two letters or because you just already know who the gnolls are?

 

[Maxperson]

Is it really because of two letters or because you just already know who the gnolls are?

None of that was gnoll specific.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Sure, but all things being equal on both sides, removal is the worse option. Better to leave something in place than take it away from people if both sides have the same ability to change things.

Earlier someone quoted Morrus about how these arguments are the same ones made to keep gender ability caps. This is one of those arguments.

Also, both sides aren’t equal. See my post above

 

[Flamestrike]

And these guys wouldn't see eye to eye on pretty much everything.

DnD makes no assumptions that people of the same alignment will see eye to eye, be friends or anything of that nature, or that people of different alignments can't work together or be friends.

Neither does fiction. HBOs Rome has LN Lucius Vorenus and CE Titus Pullo as good friends. The Good aligned Avengers fractured and fought each other. NG Deadpool works closely with LE Punisher (until Punisher goes that step too far and starts to murder people). Magneto and Charles Xavier work closely together at times and maintain a strained friendship despite being NE and LG respectively.

 

[darjr]

Earlier someone quoted Morrus about how these arguments are the same ones made to keep gender ability caps. This is one of those arguments.

Also, both sides aren’t equal. See my post above

This. You may not have argued for those other things but making the same arguments here are, to me, a sign to stop and maybe reconsider. I would.

 

[Maxperson]

Earlier someone quoted Morrus about how these arguments are the same ones made to keep gender ability caps. This is one of those arguments.

Also, both sides aren’t equal. See my post above

That's not really relevant, though. Using the same argument doesn't make it wrong. As I pointed out, the arguments in favor of being able to gamble on Cock and Dog fights is the same as being able to gamble on 7 Card Stud, Hold Em or Football games. It's the content you are arguing about, not the arguments themselves that are what is important.

 

[loverdrive]

DnD makes no assumptions that people of the same alignment will see eye to eye, be friends or anything of that nature, or that people of different alignments can't work together or be friends.

Neither does fiction. HBOs Rome has LN Lucius Vorenus and CE Titus Pullo as good friends. The Good aligned Avengers fractured and fought each other. NG Deadpool works closely with LE Punisher (until Punisher goes that step too far and starts to murder people). Magneto and Charles Xavier work closely together at times and maintain a strained friendship despite being NE and LG respectively.

Then what's the point?

If I said you, idk, Aqarys Baltabay (random name from the top of my head) is LN, what information would it give you?

Pretty much none. Ok, he respects traditions or has a code. What kind of traditions? What kind of code? I don't know. And these questions are immensely more important than "does X respect traditions or not".