Sacrifice to Caiphon - Overpowered?

[bganon]

I don't think it's overpowered in the "will this break my game" sense.

I do think it is overpowered in the "every Warlock will take this feat" sense. On the other hand, part of the point of the Dragon article seemed to be about fixing the fact that "core" Star Pact Warlocks get kinda screwed. But fixing that through feats means everyone will take those feats.

I've considered houseruling it to 4+level damage or something, just to restrain the low-level awesomeness to where one might have at least a brief second thought about using it.

 

[James McMurray]

If starlocks were otherwise a bad choice, and if the feat were only allowed for them, it wouldn't be a problem. But after the article starlocks are among the most powerful warlocks around, and the feat is available to all warlocks, and even multiclass characters.

I'm picturing a fighter / warlock whose powers are all effectively reliable, has huge hit points, and multiple ways to heal himself (including regeneration). He'd never run out of non-at wills until he'd hit with them all at least once.

 

[The_Fan]

Our group warlock has it, and I will tell you how it is always used:

"Diabolic grasp!"
*rolls a 1*
"$#@%!!!!!"
"Sacrifice to Caiphon! Action point! Diabolic grasp AGAIN!"

Not optimum use, but how it's always used.

 

[Wepwawet]

But this feat only works with Area powers? Or does it work with any power, even single target ones.
Because the description says "if you fail all targets" I assumed it could be only used with area attacks.

 

[The_Fan]

The plural is not exclusionary in general english, so I took it to mean it works with any encounter power. He has no area powers, so it would be pointless otherwise.

 

[logopolis]

I don't think it's overpowered in the "will this break my game" sense.

I agree. The feat isn't giving the character anything that he wouldn't already have if the player rolls well. In fact, if the player rolls well, the feat is kind of wasted.

I do think it is overpowered in the "every Warlock will take this feat" sense. On the other hand, part of the point of the Dragon article seemed to be about fixing the fact that "core" Star Pact Warlocks get kinda screwed. But fixing that through feats means everyone will take those feats.

Not only that, I could see characters multiclassing as warlocks for the sole purpose of taking this feat.

I've considered houseruling it to 4+level damage or something, just to restrain the low-level awesomeness to where one might have at least a brief second thought about using it.

I'm currently playing in an RPGA game, so my DM has no choice but to use Sacrifice to Caiphon as is.

I'd definitely make some tweaks to the feat for a home game, though. Maybe:

• Increase damage to 5+level or so, like bganon suggested?
• Make it a paragon or epic feat?
• Restrict its use to once per encounter?
• Restrict it to primary class star warlocks?
• Change it so you have to spend a healing surge instead of or in addition to the damage?

 

[Bold or Stupid]

I

• Increase damage to 5+level or so, like bganon suggested?
• Make it a paragon or epic feat?

The first of these is good, the feylock in the game I run uses SoC everytime he misses with Witchfire but any of his higher level encounters he tends to ponder the hp cost on. Maybe I'll go for 5+half level (round down) which should help control it.

 

[bganon]

i don't know if multiclassing for this feat is such a great deal as it might seem. You essentially get the benefits by paying two feats, 13 Cha, 13 Con, and the loss of any other multiclassing.

A fighter multiclassing into warlock just for Sacrifice to Caiphon can have tons of reliable powers, sure. But Cha is generally a pretty useless stat for fighters (Wis is slightly better as a tertiary) and not many of the warlock powers really mesh well with a fighter build. Fiendish Resilience? Unstoppable is strictly better.

Paladin/warlock is easier, but personally I think that's such a fun combo that I don't mind a little extra awesomeness . The only other class that can really take good advantage of multiclassing into Warlock is the Bard. All other classes struggle at least a bit with MAD, since no other classes use Cha or Con as a primary stat.

On a separate note, if you want the hit point cost of the feat to always be roughly 1/5th of a character's hp for their max level power, 4 or 5 + level is pretty much spot on. Making it half-level will cause the scaling to favor Epic levels (which might be fine, since recovering powers is otherwise more common at Epic anyway).

 

[logopolis]

i don't know if multiclassing for this feat is such a great deal as it might seem. You essentially get the benefits by paying two feats, 13 Cha, 13 Con, and the loss of any other multiclassing.

Actually, the prerequisite is just Con 13. It's pretty easy to get, especially for martial classes.

Now that I think about it, simply bumping up the prerequisites to Con 13 and Cha 13 might prevent abuse of this feat as well.

 

[Milambus]

Actually, the prerequisite is just Con 13. It's pretty easy to get, especially for martial classes.

Now that I think about it, simply bumping up the prerequisites to Con 13 and Cha 13 might prevent abuse of this feat as well.

You need 13 Cha to take the Warlock Multiclass feat.