Scorching Ray

[Grayhawk]

One of the defending argumenst for Scorching Ray is that fire resistance is the most common energy resistance.

So if I make a Freezing Ray spell should it do 4d6 or 3d6 (or something other) per ray?

 

[Pax]

...and in a similar vein to Grayhawk's inquiry, shouldn't Lightning Bolt then do less damage than Fireball ... ?

I like Scorching Ray at 3d6/ray. That's still darned good, IMO.

 

[Moleculo]

Not really, a spherical area of effect is a hell of a lot more useful than a line, at least in my opinion. ( i mean what are the odds that everyone is going to stand in a straight line for you? )

 

[Wycen]

Regarding lightening bolt, yes, 3.5 lightening bolts are far less desirable.
As for scorching ray, it seems nice doing 8d6 damage at 5th level, but that's 2 rolls to hit. I suppose you could say it's like the Magic Missile of 2nd level.

 

[The Souljourner]

Actually, 3.5 lightning bolt rocks ass. It's generally just as effective as 3.0 10' bolt, except it's a heck of a lot more precise. It's easy to just miss your friend in order to hit your enemy. And sometimes you can shoot it right between guys who aren't that far apart, and still hit the guy on the other side. It's cool.

The real question is, what the hell is up with cone of suck ass cold.

..and scorching ray is 8d6 at 7th level, not 5th.

-The Souljourner

 

[Grayhawk]

How does this spell measure up:

Freezing Ray
Everything as Scorching Ray, except it deals cold damage, deals 3d6 per Ray, 2 rays at 6th, 3 rays at 9th?

(It annoys me a little bit that Scorching Ray maxes out at 11th level, when 3rd level spells like Fireball and Lightning Bolt maxes out at 10th. Granted, Melf's Acid Arrow doesn't max out until 18th level, but I see that as different as it's the duration that keeps increasing.)

 

[Pax]

Not really, a spherical area of effect is a hell of a lot more useful than a line, at least in my opinion. ( i mean what are the odds that everyone is going to stand in a straight line for you? )

Given party fighters who're reasonably competent at tactical maneuvering? Quite easy, in fact. Your guys line up, whip out the ranged weapons, adn either the enemy stays far away (all the better),or comes to you and meets your "line of battle" ... thus lining themselves up quite nicely. ^_^

 

[Moleculo]

Given party fighters who're reasonably competent at tactical maneuvering? Quite easy, in fact. Your guys line up, whip out the ranged weapons, adn either the enemy stays far away (all the better),or comes to you and meets your "line of battle" ... thus lining themselves up quite nicely. ^_^

I think it is a little more complex than you think. They have to be in a straight line, 5 feet wide. I'd like to see you arrange that so you can get off the lightning bolt without roasting your comerades or dinging just one or two. This line you speak of can be easily broken up, if I am interpreting it correctly, by just flanking the party. Its easy to get two people, but much much harder to get three. Where as with fireball, unless they split up very far apart, its much easier to get two, three, even fifteen. So I guess what I am saying is the difficulty to get more than one person grows more quickly (I am avoiding big-O notation at all costs damn you to hell CompSci) with Lightning Bolt. And in your case, it is still a lot easier to use fireball than lightning bolt.

 

[Thanee]

The -8 for melee and cover almost always comes into play, ...

In our games, this is a rather rare circumstance.

Sure the -4 for being in melee against medium-sized opponents comes into play usually, but cover can be avoided easily in most situations, if the party plays as a team. Against larger opponents there is usually no penalty at all.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Pax]

I think it is a little more complex than you think.

I've seen it done, and done it myself. Does it work if the party is outnumbered by 3:1 or worse, and you insist on getting ALL of the enemy at once? No.

But then again, neither does fireball, at that point!

They have to be in a straight line, 5 feet wide.

Not exactly, they don't. Lightning bolt CAN be cast on diagonals, and so forth. And if the opponents are Large, that makes it even easier - aim for the "back" half of most of 'em, and you have even more breathing room WRT your own fighters.

Plus, with a preplanned tactic - every fighter delays until after the "big guys" have gone; they then full attack ... and 5' step AWAY. Even more room to fit that LBolt in, when your (also delayed) action comes up.

I'd like to see you arrange that so you can get off the lightning bolt without roasting your comerades or dinging just one or two.

Depends how greedy you are. Fireball seems, when placed to avoid comrades, to get an average of 2-3 enemies, uless used at extremely long range. 4-5, then.

If you insist on getting 6 or 8 enemies with your bolt, then yes, a comrade will be in the path of the bolt. Of course, that may not matter - in one campaign, I was a half-celestial, and the wizard knew that his lightning bolt wouldn't even tickle me.

But if you're happy getting the same number of targets as you likely would be able to with a fireball, you should never hit yoru friends. For a bit of risk and/or extra brainpower, you could probably get another 1-3 foes per bolt, when in close quarters.

This line you speak of can be easily broken up, if I am interpreting it correctly, by just flanking the party.

You assume either fighter incompetence, and/or overwhelming numbers. Neither assumption should be held as sufficiently universal to devalue lightning bolt.

Its easy to get two people, but much much harder to get three. Where as with fireball, unless they split up very far apart, its much easier to get two, three, even fifteen.

Fifteen? Bull. Absolute and total bull. And getting more with a Fireball requires you to get some or all of your allies, too. Fireball isn't selective!

So I guess what I am saying is the difficulty to get more than one person grows more quickly (I am avoiding big-O notation at all costs damn you to hell CompSci) with Lightning Bolt. And in your case, it is still a lot easier to use fireball than lightning bolt.

Riiiiiight ... fireball right on yoru own line of fighters, sure, that'll work, and not toast your own allies. Suuuuure ...

Feh.