D&D 5E So, 5e OGL

[jmucchiello]

The problem lead to a downturn in local stores... as in, the D20 glut hurt the shopkeepers bottom line sufficiently that many were disinclined to continue as shopkeepers.

The shopkeepers were not without blame here. They saw dollar signs in the D20 market and over bought anything with D20 on it without being knowledgeable about what companies were good and which weren't. By the time it entered their minds not to touch some D20 publishers they already had inventory that still hasn't complete sold out at fire sale prices.

A repeat of such a glut is highly unlikely as I hope they've learned their lesson.

 

[prosfilaes]

I got Nyambe for $1... and Babylon 5 d20 for $2. Worth that price for the reading and art... but I'd never run either of them.

What was wrong with either of them that the title wouldn't warn you about? The only problem I've heard about Nyambe is that the audience for African adventures wasn't huge, and that's a problem that could have been seen up front.

 

[prosfilaes]

The shopkeepers were not without blame here. They saw dollar signs in the D20 market and over bought anything with D20 on it without being knowledgeable about what companies were good and which weren't. By the time it entered their minds not to touch some D20 publishers they already had inventory that still hasn't complete sold out at fire sale prices.

And the customers who bought indiscriminately until they suddenly realized it was a bad idea and then quit. I'm pretty sure that a shopkeeper who did not buy D20 would have had trouble, as well. Can't we describe it impersonally as a market bulge and collapse, which is pretty hard for anyone but the lucky to not get hurt by?

I'm with everyone saying that the dynamics of the market are completely different and it's unlikely the same thing will happen.

 

[darjr]

The problem is if they don't want to use the OGL, it would be exactly the basic set they most want to protect. If they OGL the Basic Set, they've lost control over 5E; people can extend any part of it freely and even clone it. With the 3E OGL, what's left might be a nuisance, but not more then the stuff they didn't release for 3E.

I think this is kinda true now with the 3e OGL anyways.

 

[Nellisir]

I wonder of OGLing the basic set might be a good test balloon for WotC? It's already free to download and use for play.

I've made arguments for and against OGLing the basic set. If they do, it sets up a good base for other publishers but leaves the official advanced stuff to WotC. It also means that the first thing many people are going to do is remake all the PHB classes and races, which is frankly boring.

 

[aramis erak]

What was wrong with either of them that the title wouldn't warn you about? The only problem I've heard about Nyambe is that the audience for African adventures wasn't huge, and that's a problem that could have been seen up front.

Nyambe was a case of design not matching fluff well enough. It was too much setting fluff without mechanical support.

d20 Bab 5... it was likewise too little differentiated from stock d20 for the subject mater.

And the customers who bought indiscriminately until they suddenly realized it was a bad idea and then quit. I'm pretty sure that a shopkeeper who did not buy D20 would have had trouble, as well. Can't we describe it impersonally as a market bulge and collapse, which is pretty hard for anyone but the lucky to not get hurt by?

I'm with everyone saying that the dynamics of the market are completely different and it's unlikely the same thing will happen.

The problem of indiscriminate buying enhanced the bubble, and further, the lack of good feedback channels to retailers made it worse than it had to be. But the market isn't sufficiently different to prevent a glut. It may not be the crisis it was, but the d20 glut still makes sorting the wheat from the chaff on DTRPG a challenge...

The feedback channels are better. Sales are down overall... But the sales at the brick and mortar are MORE important on a sale by sale basis.

For Traveller, the OGL publishers range from passable to better-than-mongoose... but none of them make it to my FLGS until after being recommended by fans.

And the use of Kickstarter hurts FLGS's more than it helps...

 

[Nellisir]

It may not be the crisis it was, but the d20 glut still makes sorting the wheat from the chaff on DTRPG a challenge...

DTRPG barely existed in 2002, if it existed at all (I know RPGNow did). The Book of Eldritch Might, which really kicked off the pdf market, was published in mid-2001, and was published in print by White Wolf. The pdf market essentially didn't exist in 2002. Now it's the primary market for small and mid-level publishers. The large publishers, after the d20 glut and the issues with 4e and the GSL, aren't going to leap into the 5e market with 32 books and a 9-part campaign adventure for kobold ear sorcerers.

So yeah, there may very well be some kind of 5e pdf glut, but it's not going to surge out to the FLGS like it did 12-14 years ago.

 

[aramis erak]

What was wrong with either of them that the title wouldn't warn you about? The only problem I've heard about Nyambe is that the audience for African adventures wasn't huge, and that's a problem that could have been seen up front.

[/QUOTE]

It did. I've got stuff in my DTRPG/RPGNow (They've been the same company and database for several years now) that was updated in 2002... and didn't use RPGNow at all until about 2004. Plus, there were other points of sale predating. Hyperbooks online has since gone out of business, but they date back to about 1998.

 

[Nellisir]

It did. I've got stuff in my DTRPG/RPGNow (They've been the same company and database for several years now) that was updated in 2002... and didn't use RPGNow at all until about 2004. Plus, there were other points of sale predating. Hyperbooks online has since gone out of business, but they date back to about 1998.

You've got that backwards. RPGNow started in 2001; DriveThruRPG in 2004. Source? DriveThru's "About Us" page.

We started in 2001 (the same year Apple launched iTunes) when James Mathe launched RPGNow. It may be common today to download a book and read it on a computer, tablet, or phone, but RPGNow and a handful of roleplaying game publishers pioneered downloadable PDFs in the gaming community.
In 2004, Mike Todd, Chris McDonough and Steve Wieck started DriveThruRPG. DriveThruRPG and RPGNow's combined efforts made both out-of-print and in-print RPGs easily available in electronic format to fans around the world.
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/about.php

 

[TrippyHippy]

Would it be possible to create an open license to publish D&D modules and original settings - but leave the rules of the game untouched? That would work for me, at least.