D&D 5E So, 5e OGL

[Hussar]

Example: https://www.kickstarter.com/project...ons-5e-the-city-under-the-mountai/description
The City Under the Mountain adventure, with some pretty cheap backer rewards. Low risk since he's already done a few adventures. It even made the front page of ENworld. It raised all of £1,268 (or $1978 USD).
He started low, with £60, which helped him succeed. Had he asked for £560 and it was his first adventure, he'd probably have scared off everyone.

So some completely unknown guy with almost zero connections can raise two grand for a module but springing for a lawyer is totally out of the question?

Again I'm not seeing the problem with keeping out the riff raff.

Otoh I don't get out of bed for less than about fifty dollars an hour so I'm really not going to try to publish anything.

 

[delericho]

Why would you think that? An attorney can't give you a clear pass, like the OGL combined with a friendly WotC can.

Indeed. And even if one could, he could only do so for the document(s) he's actually looked over, not some theoretical future document you might later produce. A lot of the concerns are really about the detail, and the detail of product A is going to be different from the detail of product B, even if A and B are broadly similar.

Can you publish a book about an ettercap-fey war, given that the SRD ettercap entry said nothing about the fey and that was all new to 5E? What happens if you have a darkmantle show up on the plane of shadow, another 5E innovation?

Possibly bad examples, here: WotC can claim no ownership over 'fey', 'war', or 'plane of shadow' (Shadowfell, on the other hand...). Or, rather, I suppose they can claim it, but...

 

[delericho]

So some completely unknown guy with almost zero connections can raise two grand for a module but springing for a lawyer is totally out of the question?

$700 for a lawyer, out of a budget of $2000 is pretty significant - that's a third less funding available for writing, art, and all the other things that people will actually see.

And, yeah, maybe that's just a necessary cost of doing business that people have to suck up. But, in all honesty, I'd much rather they didn't have to. Let's have people spend the money where it will actually do some good.

Again I'm not seeing the problem with keeping out the riff raff.

It actually negates that point of having the OGL at all. The OGL was never actually necessary to publish third-party materials, it just provided a safe harbour in which to do so. If you have to consult an IP lawyer every time to make sure you're acting safely within the license, you might as well not bother with the license and instead just consult the lawyer on more general IP law. With the added advantage that you can they mark your product "Compatible with D&D 5", which you agree not to do if you use the OGL.

 

[Hussar]

But $700 out of a budget of 15000 doesn't seem to extreme. Thus my point.

 

[delericho]

But $700 out of a budget of 15000 doesn't seem to extreme. Thus my point.

The list of companies that can raise $15k for a product is extremely short - maybe 20 names in all. If that's what you mean by weeding out the riff-raff, you're actually excluding everyone who isn't already an established name.

(And it should be noted that a person's willingness to donate 100 man-hours, or whatever, of their time for a product doesn't imply that they're also willing or able to front $700 for legal fees for the same. Despite the adage that "time is money", opportunities to exchange the one for the other aren't guaranteed, and people very often have different amounts of the two resources.)

 

[Mark CMG]

Otoh I don't get out of bed for less than about fifty dollars an hour so (. . .)

Funny. That's my motto for getting in . . .

 

[Hussar]

Lol MarkCMG. Can't posrep from phone.

 

[prosfilaes]

Possibly bad examples, here: WotC can claim no ownership over 'fey', 'war', or 'plane of shadow' (Shadowfell, on the other hand...). Or, rather, I suppose they can claim it, but...

I would say the Holmes estate can't claim copyright over retirement, either, but they sued over it. Can people use the distinctive plot elements unique to the 5E Monster Manual versions of OGL creatures? I'm not nearly so calm as you that they can't claim ownership over them.

 

[Jester David]

So some completely unknown guy with almost zero connections can raise two grand for a module but springing for a lawyer is totally out of the question?

Again I'm not seeing the problem with keeping out the riff raff.

It was closer to $1880 after Kickstarter fees. Likely $1500 after taxes if he was smart enough to leave a buffer. He also had to pay any artists, which isn't cheap.
And he's not entirely unknown: he did two other adventures people could buy to see that he was able to deliver on his promises, one of which is selling well on Drive-Thru. And it was his second Kickstarter. His first raised less: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/442231682/5th-edition-dungeons-and-dragons-beneath-the-razor. That one made $690. Or $540 after everything.
And from the look of the sample pieces, he didn't consult a lawyer as his statblocks are a little too close to WotC's in format. If he had talked to a lawyer, he'd have likely lost money from his first Kickstarter and just be out of the hole. Heck, the risks section of the Kickstarter don't even mention the risk of WotC shutting things down, so I'm not sure how aware he is of the OGL.

Otoh I don't get out of bed for less than about fifty dollars an hour so I'm really not going to try to publish anything.

And that's the catch. Your standards are higher than freelance standards. Heck, they're high for most professions as the average hourly wage is under $30/hour. That's gonna skew your perspective.
Especially since, when making $50/hour (or higher) a $1000 legal fees tab is managable. I make under $25/hour and work short hours, so a $1000 legal fee wipes out most of a paycheque. With budgeting, that's five months of saving to even consider the option and involves me not buying any new books or going to the movie or generally spending anything on non-essentials.

Making D&D content shouldn't be exclusive to the wealthy. You shouldn't need a loan to get started. It shouldn't be comparable to starting up a full-time business.
Especially since we want to encourage you people to get invested in the game.
Especially not these days when anyone with a computer can self-publish.

 

[SkidAce]

Funny. That's my motto for getting in . . .

Beat me to it...