D&D General So how do Half-Elfs feel different to Elfs?

[Misanthrope Prime]

You’re mixing up Mielikki and Loviatar. Unless the Goddess of animals took a bad turn somewhere? I knew her unicorn Goddess friend Lurue was a bad influence on her! What, with that horn of hers and all…

Right, my mistake.

It's still weird how we're supposed to respect the folk beliefs for elves but we can bebop and scat over gods unless they're Jehovah.

 

[Charlaquin]

There's real life people who believe in Loviatar but that doesn't stop d&d from turning her into a leather fetish BDSM goddess, so why are we suddenly caring about the sensitivities of people who think elves are real?

Why are you asking me?

 

[Maxperson]

My point is, any setting is legitimate in 2024.

Yes, any homebrew setting is legitimate in 5.5e. As it was in 5e, 4e, 3.5e, 3e, 2e, 1e and BECMI.

Where you are going wrong is in making statements that indicate that the default 5.5e elf is the Norse elf. It isn't.

Which books are you referring to in order to play the one "true" D&D elves? I get the sense that you are referring to earlier editions of D&D, but these books are no longer canonical. (And the elven "subraces" changed radically in each edition anyway.) You can choose a particular setting, like 2024 Greyhawk or even pull out 1e Greyhawk by Gygax to use it as the setting. There is no reason to assume that Sea Elves exist in 2024 Greyhawk, and if they do perhaps Shadar-kai, Eladrin, and Astral Elves exist as well, unlike in 1e Greyhawk. The Elves in a setting are a choice.

Come on dude. It's not cool to misportray what someone says that badly. I've said in virtually every post that your homebrew Norse elves are really cool. That flat out says that there's not one true way to play elves.

As for which books indicate D&D elves use D&D lore.........it's all of them dealing with elves. The 5e PHB, the 5.5e PHB, and Mordenkainen's which since it hasn't been reprinted with different elf lore in 5.5e, are still the controlling books for the default lore.

I bolded and underlined default so you wouldn't accuse me of one true wayism again.

The DM isnt beholden to Monster Manual lore, because again monsters depend on setting, and the DM can and should modify appropriately. The Drider entry mentions that Lolth likes to transform her "drow worshipers" into Driders. But also adds that a powerful Hag or Mindflayer among others can also turn creatures into Driders. It depends on the setting. If a "Drow priestess of Lolth" exists, it reformats as a "Fiend Cultist". Even if a Lolth cult exists in the setting, the expectation seems to be that most Drow have nothing to do with it per the Players Handbook.

During session zero, the DM and the players decide on a setting. Whatever they pick will be the "true" way to play Elves for them.

Nobody claimed the DM was beholden to how D&D presents its elves. I'm just saying your Norse elves are a homebrew version of them. That doesn't make them bad. It does make them changed from the D&D default elves.

 

[Yaarel]

As for which books indicate D&D elves use D&D lore.........it's all of them dealing with elves. The 5e PHB, the 5.5e PHB, and Mordenkainen's which since it hasn't been reprinted with different elf lore in 5.5e, are still the controlling books for the default lore.

I bolded and underlined default so you wouldn't accuse me of one true wayism again.

Neither Mordenkainens Tome of Foes nor Mordenkainen Presents Monsters of the Multiverse are canon. 5e 2014 never considered them canonical, and neither does 5e 2024. So it is incorrect to speak of these books as "default".

If a DM and players want to opt in and use the setting lore from these books for the setting they choose, obviously they can do that. Indeed, I never used MPMM during 2014, but am now cherry-picking thru it for 2024. But there is no default canonical pressure to do so.

The 2014 Players Handbook is no longer canon. 2024 replaces it, especially with regard to Elves. If players want to opt in to use the 2014 Half Elf they can. Or if theyd rather, play the Eberron setting and the Khoravar, or import the Khoravar into whatever setting. Or simply use the Players Handbook Human or Elf stats for the Half Elf. At the moment, there is no canon way to play a Half Elf.

Again, if players want to pull out their 1e setting books or 2e or 3e or 4e for the Elves there, they can do that. 2024 purposely makes it easy to do this.

 

[Yaarel]

Discussing cultural sensitivity is very relevant. Discussing your personal spiritual beliefs is not. If you have a problem with the depiction of elves because you believe they’re real and you’re descended from them… that’s not really something I can argue about, but it seems incredibly inappropriate to be telling people how they should run elves at their table on that basis, given that religion is an off-limits topic.

You are mischaracterizing Nordic cultures.

 

[Maxperson]

Neither Mordenkainens Tome of Foes nor Mordenkainen Presents Monsters of the Multiverse are canon. 5e 2014 never considered them canonical, and neither does 5e 2024. So it is incorrect to speak of these books as "default".

If a DM and players want to opt in and use the setting lore from these books for the setting they choose, obviously they can do that. Indeed, I never used MPMM during 2014, but am now cherry-picking thru it for 2024. But there is no default canonical pressure to do so.

The 2014 Players Handbook is no longer canon. 2024 replaces it, especially with regard to Elves. If players want to opt in to use the 2014 Half Elf they can. Or if theyd rather, play the Eberron setting and the Khoravar, or import the Khoravar into whatever setting. Or simply use the Players Handbook Human or Elf stats for the Half Elf. At the moment, there is no canon way to play a Half Elf.

Again, if players want to pull out their 1e setting books or 2e or 3e or 4e for the Elves there, they can do that. 2024 purposely makes it easy to do this.

Try as you might, you can't make the 5.5e PHB elves be Norse elves. You can only homebrew your elves to be Norse elves in YOUR game. The default 5.5e PHB elves are D&D elves, not Norse.

 

[Remathilis]

Meh. I'll wait for WotC to hire a "real elf" to write "The Real Complete Book of Elves"

 

[Maxperson]

Meh. I'll wait for WotC to hire a "real elf" to write "The Real Complete Book of Elves"

I'm betting they hire Bilbo to write it.

 

[Yaarel]

Try as you might, you can't make the 5.5e PHB elves be Norse elves. You can only homebrew your elves to be Norse elves in YOUR game. The default 5.5e PHB elves are D&D elves, not Norse.

You cant make 2024 Elves be 1e Elves. You can only homebrew a setting that distinguishes between High, Grey, Faerie, and Valley, and between Wood and Grugach, and add a Sea Elf.

Similarly for 2e, 3e, or 4e, each with their own kinds of Elves across various settings. You cant even make 2024 Elves be MPMM Elves or Spelljammer Elves or Lorwyn Elves.

The only "default" Elves that exist are in the 2024 Players Handbook. Everything else requires the DM to choose a setting, such as homebrew or Forgotten Realms, or anything.

 

[Maxperson]

You cant make 2024 Elves be 1e Elves. You can only homebrew a setting that distinguishes between High, Grey, Faerie, and Valley, and between Wood and Grugach, and add a Sea Elf.

I don't know what you mean by that. My argument here has only ever been about 5e and 5.5e.