D&D (2024) Sorcerer brainstorm

[Blue]

What I wouldn't do is move to spell points from slots. We did several playtests with the DMG variant, and invariably the players would use more higher level slots then the spell slot system had, and run through their spell points. And then be either bored and barely useful for a normal adventuring day, or if they can convince others to long rest a lot they instead were much more powerful then the other classes.

Even when people saw others running out of points through using high level slots, when they were playing a caster (we ran at several different levels) they ended up doing the same.

Basically, spell points let them nova harder then been all of the other casters,a and then be bored. Even if their contribution over the adventuring day balances out with several combats of basically cantrips, it's not fun to play.

 

[Neonchameleon]

What I want for the sorcerer is to be subclass driven. For the casters I dislike the Clockwork Soul but that's because I dislike the variance lowering. I think the aberrant mind is right in terms of power and (non-tentacle) mechanics for a primary caster sorcerer subclass.

But what I want is to see them push the boat out on things like the dragon subclass, making it into a melee brawler subclass, significantly amping up its durability and melee damage, and having it breathe in combat every couple of rounds while being able to apply sorcery points to the breath weapon either to make it a bonus action or to make it stronger. I want the storm sorcerer to be bouncing in and through the combat, always getting close and living life on the edge but causing carnage. But again they need to be tougher than they are to make that something other than suicide.

 

[Bill Zebub]

This is pretty general, but...

1. More spells known, but from shorter, subclass-flavored lists (plus maybe a very short base class list)
   1. Or at least give every subclass bonus spells known
2. Generate sorcery points unpredictably (crits?)
3. Somehow use Con and/or Hit Dice to fuel magic
4. Change wild magic so that every time it doesn't proc the chance goes up by 1 (5%), then resets when eventually it procs
   1. And really what would make the class awesome is to get rid of the wild magic subclass completely and give every subclass their own, unique wild magic table. Not gonna happen, I know.

 

[tetrasodium]

What I wouldn't do is move to spell points from slots. We did several playtests with the DMG variant, and invariably the players would use more higher level slots then the spell slot system had, and run through their spell points. And then be either bored and barely useful for a normal adventuring day, or if they can convince others to long rest a lot they instead were much more powerful then the other classes.

Even when people saw others running out of points through using high level slots, when they were playing a caster (we ran at several different levels) they ended up doing the same.

Basically, spell points let them nova harder then been all of the other casters,a and then be bored. Even if their contribution over the adventuring day balances out with several combats of basically cantrips, it's not fun to play.

That's been my experience every time I've run or played in a game with spell points since they were a thing back in the 3.x days as well. Bob burns all of his spell points on the spell with the most bang for the buck even though he could never cast it so often with a normal spell slot build & then he either sits bored twiddling his thumbs or tries to dig in for a rest so he can start that process over on repeat. I don't know why anyone pushes for spell points in d&d if they've ever used them

 

[mellored]

That's been my experience every time I've run or played in a game with spell points since they were a thing back in the 3.x days as well. Bob burns all of his spell points on the spell with the most bang for the buck even though he could never cast it so often with a normal spell slot build & then he either sits bored twiddling his thumbs or tries to dig in for a rest so he can start that process over on repeat. I don't know why anyone pushes for spell points in d&d if they've ever used them

There can always be a limit on how many points you could spend per round.
Or cost extra points if you cast the same spell multiple times in a row.
Or something else.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

I would do away with flexible casting and using sorcery points to power subclass features. I would give each subclass the normal 10 bonus spells, but you have to use sorcery points to cast them, and you have to cast them at the lowest level. However, once you spend the sorcery points, you can cast that spell at will for a minute without using spell slots. You can only have one sorcery point spell active at a time. The bonus spells are going to be damage-causing spells (can't have the sorcerer spamming healing spells), but this means you have some more space in your spell list for utility spells.

The other thing you could do is make sorcery points tack on some subclass specific effects, probably one effect for damage spells, one for buffing, and one for debuffing. For example, I could see a black dragon origin giving you the ability to add acid damage to any damage spells, a wild magic origin turning you into an ooze when you cast mage armor on yourself, a storm sorcerer casting hex on someone and making them vulnerable to lightning damage while the hex is in place, etc.

I wouldn't suggest doing both things, but either direction would give the sorcerer enough distinction from other casters to be worthwhile.

 

[Bill Zebub]

How about...

1. Class gets 1 spell known per level from a short list of sorcerer spells, plus five more subclass spells (one each of spell levels 1-5). These spells are all (or mostly?) non-damaging spells.
2. The class gets its own unique nuking mechanic that doesn't use spell slots. Subclasses augment this mechanic in various ways.

 

[Horwath]

1. Spell points default increased by sorcery points amount,
2. More metamagic options,
3. If short rests will still be a thing then restoration of some amount of spell points per short rest,
4. Every subclass gives 2 cantrips and 2 spells know from levels 1-5. Like current aberrant mind/clockwork. Those fixed spells could be replaced by a spell from 2 or 3 schools,
5. Sorcerers do not use material components and do not need spell focuses(unless they want them for magic bonuses) unless components have a GP cost and they are consumed in casting.

 

[Olrox17]

Love the idea of making them Con based. Makes thematic sense, and it reduces the ungodly amount of cha casters.
Then, you can have specific sorcerer subclasses using charisma (or wis, or int, or strength!) for subclass features, just so the sorcerer does not become a single ability class.

I really like, for example, the idea of a con/str dragon sorcerer that can tear enemies to shred with natural weapons as well as blast them with elemental magic.

 

[Minigiant]

In a version of a perfect edition, sorcerers would be a at-will and short rest caster and warlocks the at-will and long rest caster. But I digress.

To me the best way to do the 5e to ODND sorcerer is to formalize what sorcery points do and how you get them.

How to get sorcery points.

1. Taking a Long rest gives you all your sorcery points.
2. Spend a HD during a short rest gives you 2 sorcery points each
3. Convert spell slot into a sorcery points of the spells level

Things to do with sorcery points

1. Convert spell points into spell slots
2. Use metamagic on a spell
3. Cast a sorcery

Sorceries would be nonspell magic that thesorcerer class and origin would have available at all times. Things like hurling balls of raw magic or growing scales and claws (draconic) or knowing the current time and the time of events (clockwerk).