Special Conversion Thread: Lycanthropes and their ilk

[freyar]

Dominate Felines and Panther Trance kind of overlap, as would the dominate part of Command Thrall. I think I'd just keep the charm monster part of Command Thrall.

Curse of the Panther Lord looks good, though I don't think I'd include giants.

 

[Cleon]

Dominate Felines and Panther Trance kind of overlap.

Eh? The current Panther Trance does not allow the Panther Lord any control over a linked feline, and the only communication it allows is having the panther lord send messages to its thralls.

Oh I see, you're referring to the fact dominate monster allows the caster to "receive full sensory input as interpreted by the mind of the subject, though it still can’t communicate with you".

as would the dominate part of Command Thrall. I think I'd just keep the charm monster part of Command Thrall.

So you'd prefer:

Charm Thrall (Su): All werepanther thralls are permanently charmed (as the charm monster spell) by the panther lord that created them.

I'd rather the power allow the panther lord to actually control its thralls, rather than merely making them see the lord as their best buddy in the whole wide jungle. Thus, I'd rather keep the dominate effect. Upon second thoughts, I'd favor extending it to multiple thralls rather than one-at-a-time, although probably without the bit about Panther Trance allowing unlimited range.

Curse of the Panther Lord looks good, though I don't think I'd include giants.

I was against including giants as well, which is why that bit is in a different colour.

Any preferences for the DC of the Curse?

 

[freyar]

That, and the Trance's ability to send simple commands to the thralls, much like dominate. So I'm not opposed to allowing the panther lord to command/control the thralls, but I'd prefer to reduce redundancy in the mechanics.

As for the curse DC, what about 20? It shouldn't be too easy for low-level types to avoid.

 

[Cleon]

That, and the Trance's ability to send simple commands to the thralls, much like dominate. So I'm not opposed to allowing the panther lord to command/control the thralls, but I'd prefer to reduce redundancy in the mechanics.

Hmm... how about if we get out of this impasse by moving the message-of-command bit from Panther Trance to Command Thralls, which'd make that ability work more like dominate animal than dominate monster. We could say Command Thrall can be used to dominate a single thrall via Panther Trance or multiple thralls via normal line-of-effect. I'd keep the 90 foot range for the latter.

As for the curse DC, what about 20? It shouldn't be too easy for low-level types to avoid.

We could just give it a standard level-and-Charisma based Difficulty Class, which'd work out to DC 18. That seems enough.

 

[freyar]

I can go for all that. Care to write it up?

 

[Cleon]

I can go for all that. Care to write it up?

I'll give it a shot…

So far we're talking:

Command Thrall (Su): All werepanther thralls are permanently charmed (as the charm monster spell) by the panther lord that created them. The panther lord can also dominate its thralls (as the dominate animal spell, no save). The maximum number of thralls the the panther lord can dominate simultaneously is 3 plus the lord's Charisma modifier (minimum 1). The domination effect normally has a range of 90 feet, but if the lord enters Panther Trance (see below) the range encompasses the panther lord's entire territory.

Dominate Felines (Su): Panther lords can use dominate animal (felines only) at will as if they were 16th-level clerics.

Panther Trance (Su): change the last paragraph from

A panther lord can use Panther Trance to send simple telepathic instructions of up to three words ("kill", "capture slaves", "return with loot") to one of the panther lord's werepanther thralls.

to

A panther lord can use Panther Trance to extend the range of its ability to dominate its werepanther thralls (see Command Thrall, above) to reach any thrall within its territory.

Oh, and are making its Cursed Bite Charisma-based or a fixed DC 20? I don't much mind either way.

 

[freyar]

Yes, all that is good.

Oh, let's go with Cha-based on the curse.

 

[Cleon]

Yes, all that is good.

Oh, let's go with Cha-based on the curse.

Updating the Panther Lord Working Draft.

So we've just got Armour Class, Challenge Rating and Skills left to finish off as far as the mechanical side of it goes.

I think the skills and CR look good as they are.

For the Armour Class, the original monster appears to have the same AC as its thralls, or 17-18 in our 3E conversion. Should we aim for that, or aim for the AC 20 of the Jackal Lord?

 

[freyar]

Right now, it's got AC 22 with the chain shirt and the +4 natural. That's about right for CR 8, at least compared to something like an erinyes. So I'd go with that.

 

[Cleon]

Right now, it's got AC 22 with the chain shirt and the +4 natural. That's about right for CR 8, at least compared to something like an erinyes. So I'd go with that.

The current redded AC is just a placeholder copied from the Jackal Lord which has a masterwork chainshirt. Rmember that the panther lord won't enjoy the benefits of a chainshirt (or any other armor) when in hybrid or animal form.

I'd be inclined to just fiddle the numbers and either give it a higher NA in hybrid/animal form that just "coincidentally" results in the same AC as in its human form or remove the armour and give it the same NA in all forms.

i.e.:

Armor Class #1: 20 (+4 Dex, +6 natural [animal/hybrid form] or +4 Dex, +2 masterwork leather, +4 natural [human form]), touch 14, flat-footed 16

Or:

Armor Class #2: 20 (+4 Dex and +6 natural), touch 14, flat-footed 16

Bear in mind that it'll have an additional +3 enhancement to its AC when it has its barkskin spell running.