Star Wars Saga Edition [SECR] Preview #3 is Up

[Stalker0]

Hmm. Bonus damage instead of iterative attacks? I can definitely deal with that. It does make me wonder if they're going to be simplifying natural attacks or attacking with two weapons.

I think its the new threshold system that allows them to do this. In general, losing iterative attacks for a +3 to damage would be crap, especially as your level gets higher. However, now a big single amount of damage is a lot more useful because of the chance of debiliatating someone, so the bonus damage is more reasonable.

 

[Sir Brennen]

Another point brought up by the designers and their reasoning behind this... Iterative attacks depend on the attacker just standing there and whacking away. Wow. That's cinematic. :\

If this change plays both to the new Damage Track mechanic and makes the game play more like the movies, then that's a very good change.

(Also, I'm guessing that +3 damage is whenever a character hits. Compared to the extra damage for a Full-Attack in D&D, which only happens if the character didn't move, damage over time is probably going to be similar.)

 

[Plane Sailing]

Mainly because I intensely dislike the per-encounter design, because it brings in the problem of characters having effectively limitless resources. It's too much "wuxia" for me, if you understand where I'm coming from.

OK, I see where you are coming from now.

To expand on my appreciation for the concept:

I think that one of the potential benefits of per-encounter design is that it should be easier to balance classes (at the moment wizards and psions are utterly brilliant in overland travel with one encounter per day, but have to be far more circumspect if in a dungeon with a dozen potential encounters per day - the power of those caster types can swing hugely dependent upon number of encounters (or expected number of encounters).

On the other hand, there are probably loads of D&D spells that you would never want to see spammable every minute, and if incorporated into D&D then existing base classes like wizard and cleric would probably change beyond recognition!

Another potential benefit of per-encounter design is that it can seem less arbitrary than x/day uses of special class abilities. I -can- explain x/day abilities, but I'd rather not have to do so!

However, I definitely understand how it could lead to a style (such as wuxia) which doesn't match ones mental image of a particular RPG genre.

Cheers

 

[Henry]

OK, I see where you are coming from now.

To expand on my appreciation for the concept:

Agreed on all points. For designers, it definitely makes more sense, and most players will love it to no end - heck, no long-term accounting? I can use my main "big gun" several times a day? Bring it on!

For me, it's just that "catch your breath for a few minutes thing" that bugs me. I'd even get behind a system that refreshes you in a few hours (I love both the VP cost for Force powers, and in d20 the True Sorcery/Black Company spell system, for example). But not even a marathon runner can run a four minute mile, rest a minute, run a four minute mile, rest a minute, and run it again. If he caught his breath for a short while, then he could, but it tachs out my plausible-meter a little too much.

In Star wars, when a Jedi rests or trances for a few hours, he's good to go again, but I can't remember a scene in the movies where a jedi took a minute break and was as good as new again; maybe Qui-Gonn, but I'd have called that scene with the energy fields separating him and Darth Maul as more of a "take the opportunity to bring up some more powers or bonuses" than a breather that restored them both --otherwise, Qui-Gonn probably wouldn't have lost.

 

[nerfherder]

Yeah, that must account for it.

Looking at the Death Star Trooper, with no CON bonus, and assuming that Soldier gets D10, that means the Nonheroic class must also be D10.

Lvl1 (nonH) = 3*10 = 30
Lvl2 (nonH) = 5.5 = 35
Lvl3 (nonH) = 5.5 = 41
Lvl4 (Sol) = 5.5 = 46

I would have assumed the Nonheroic class would have got a D6.

WizO_the_Hutt has just posted this on the Wizards board:
"Sorry, I just noticed a glitch in Sterling's Death Star Trooper -- the hit points should be 13, not 46."

I wonder if that mean they get D4 hit dice, and no trebling at first level?

3*2.5 (average D4 for non-heroic) + 5.5 (average D10 for Soldier) = 13hp

 

[Turjan]

"Sorry, I just noticed a glitch in Sterling's Death Star Trooper -- the hit points should be 13, not 46."

Good grief. The difference is that small it's hardly noticeable (where's this smiley when you need it?).

Did they say anything regarding the difference in level and CL in the Jensaarai Defender writeup?

I already see myself taking a pencil and going through that book correcting paragraph after paragraph once it will have been published.

 

[Nine Hands]

Agreed on all points. For designers, it definitely makes more sense, and most players will love it to no end - heck, no long-term accounting? I can use my main "big gun" several times a day? Bring it on!

For me, it's just that "catch your breath for a few minutes thing" that bugs me. I'd even get behind a system that refreshes you in a few hours (I love both the VP cost for Force powers, and in d20 the True Sorcery/Black Company spell system, for example). But not even a marathon runner can run a four minute mile, rest a minute, run a four minute mile, rest a minute, and run it again. If he caught his breath for a short while, then he could, but it tachs out my plausible-meter a little too much.

In Star wars, when a Jedi rests or trances for a few hours, he's good to go again, but I can't remember a scene in the movies where a jedi took a minute break and was as good as new again; maybe Qui-Gonn, but I'd have called that scene with the energy fields separating him and Darth Maul as more of a "take the opportunity to bring up some more powers or bonuses" than a breather that restored them both --otherwise, Qui-Gonn probably wouldn't have lost.

Ahh but you are missing one minor detail. Its 1 minute per power used. So, if you blew off 6 powers, you get one back a minute over a 6 minute period of resting. Not a huge deal, but certainly not enough time for you. Of course, its an easy house rule to drop in a 10 minute wait per power to return. I kind of like the effect, its sort of like D&D spell casting but not per day.

 

[nerfherder]

Good grief. The difference is that small it's hardly noticeable (where's this smiley when you need it?).

Did they say anything regarding the difference in level and CL in the Jensaarai Defender writeup?

Not that I've seen. They have said that CL = (non-heroic level)/3 + heroic level.

 

[Henry]

Good grief. The difference is that small it's hardly noticeable (where's this smiley when you need it?).

Did they say anything regarding the difference in level and CL in the Jensaarai Defender writeup?

I already see myself taking a pencil and going through that book correcting paragraph after paragraph once it will have been published.

So you're assuming the book's going to have massive errors in it because the web site examples do? It'll have errors, I'm certain, but I somehow doubt it'll be "paragraph after paragraph."

By the way, the 13 hit points probably means the nonheoric characters ONLY get 1 hit dice, like they did (basically) in Star Wars as it stands now. It's an easy mistake to advance an NPC the same way you would a PC, especially since you would in other d20 games. I'm willing to bet that 13 hit points comes from only 1d10.

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

For me, it's just that "catch your breath for a few minutes thing" that bugs me. I'd even get behind a system that refreshes you in a few hours (I love both the VP cost for Force powers, and in d20 the True Sorcery/Black Company spell system, for example). But not even a marathon runner can run a four minute mile, rest a minute, run a four minute mile, rest a minute, and run it again. If he caught his breath for a short while, then he could, but it tachs out my plausible-meter a little too much.

A marathon-runner can't... but Indiana Jones could. A marathon-runner can't... but Conan could.

For that matter, why can a fighter, a physical character who is thus somewhat related to realism, go all day, every day - but a wizard, whose powers are completely divorced from reality, can't?

Your plausible-meter could use some adjusting, methinks, if it buys 'shooting fireballs from your hands' and 'being able to fight with a sword all day long without getting tired,' but not 'being able to shoot fireballs every few minutes.' Once you've accepted the first concept, the third is no more or less 'realistic,' whereas the second remains silly in either case - and unlike EITHER the first or the third, it can actually be tested and relates to the objection you voice in the quoted passage.