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Yaarel

Mind Mage
I've never understood that when it comes to lore. Official mechanics(races, feats, etc.) I get, but not lore. It's just way too mutable and easy to change, and really affects nothing outside of itself. For instance, my spelljammer still has crystal spheres and wildspace is NOT part of the astral plane. And done. Super easy and ships can still sail to the astral sea and go to other worlds. Any monsters in the spelljammer compendium that reference the astral no longer do. If they have an ability that depends on it, well it still functions and is powered a different way.
Being "official" relates to designers supporting a tradition, communities aware of the tradition, shared experiences, and ease of communicating.

A common language of a wider group.

Official matters.

Here at ENWorld I peruse the 5e forum.

I dont peruse Pathfinder or other systems, because they arent part of my shared experience.

A community that I can relate to and chat with is valuable.

"Official" is part of that. At least, official is the structure.
 

I’m going to disagree here. The module leans hard on FR. Off the top of my head

1. The temple of Ohgma is run by a Shou man.
2. Harpers hire the party in Curious Tale of Wisteria Vale.
3. The Yuan-ti in the Grippli adventure (whose name I totally forget) are very closely tied to FR.
4. Lore of Larue is 100% FR.
5. Sarah of Yellowcrest Manor is plonked into Waterdeep
6. Price of Beauty is tied straight into FR.

Could you rewrite these to put them in a different setting? Sure. Of course you can. But it’s not really a stretch to say that CM is meant to be played in Forgotten Realms.
7. Cloudpeaks in Zikran’s Zephyrean Tome
8. Cloakwood in The Book of Inner Alchemy
9. Tashluta in the The Canopic Being
10. Baldur's Gate features in at least three of the adventures.
11. Anauroch and the Bedine in Alkazaar’s Appendix.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
Being "official" relates to designers supporting a tradition, communities aware of the tradition, shared experiences, and ease of communicating.

A common language of a wider group.

Official matters.

Here at ENWorld I peruse the 5e forum.

I dont peruse Pathfinder or other systems, because they arent part of my shared experience.

A community that I can relate to and chat with is valuable.

"Official" is part of that. At least, official is the structure.
Sure. So when you have a discussion on a forum, you can acknowledge what is official and written and talk about it. Nothing compels you to use any or all of a setting in your home game, though. And if you make changes, it doesn't mess with the players, since you told them about it.
 



Yaarel

Mind Mage
Sure. So when you have a discussion on a forum, you can acknowledge what is official and written and talk about it. Nothing compels you to use any or all of a setting in your home game, though. And if you make changes, it doesn't mess with the players, since you told them about it.
For example.

Psionics being officially "core" or not is a big deal for finding and playing and discussing psionics.

Official matters.

It matters to me, anyway.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
For example.

Psionics being officially "core" or not is a big deal for finding and playing and discussing psionics.

Official matters.

It matters to me, anyway.
So you'd rather include the lore that fundamentally alters Eberron in ways you don't like, than make the simple change of saying, "That didn't happen."? All you have to say are three words and Eberron would be just like it was.
 

Yaarel

Mind Mage
So you'd rather include the lore that fundamentally alters Eberron in ways you don't like, than make the simple change of saying, "That didn't happen."? All you have to say are three words and Eberron would be just like it was.
The problem is the Forgotten Realms gods are a kind of plague − much like Cthulhu − who contaminate, corrupt, self-replicate, and mutate, until there is nothing left of the setting except Forgotten Realms gray goo.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
The problem is the Forgotten Realms gods are a kind of plague − much like Cthulhu − who contaminate, corrupt, self-replicate, mutate, and disintegrate into oblivion, until there is nothing left of the setting except Forgotten Realms gray goo.
I've been running the Realms since 1e and I have no idea what you are talking about.
 



Yaarel

Mind Mage
There is no grey goo in the Realms. Like none at all. Any goo in your game is of your own creation.
I am being facetious about "gray goo".

More seriously, other settings that have premises that are unlike Forgotten Realms, are not allowed to exist.

Forgotten Realms content and setting premises assimilates all other settings.

It is like a cultural assimilation. There is no space left for diverse settings.

Everything is becoming a form of Forgotten Realms, and seeing Forgotten Realms gods, is like seeing Cthulhu self-replicating as the "foreign" culture gets assimilated.

Or like the Star Trek borg. Forgotten Realms behaves like that.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
I am being facetious about "gray goo".

More seriously, other settings that have premises that are unlike Forgotten Realms, are not allowed to exist.

Forgotten Realms content and setting premises assimilates all other settings.
It doesn't. The DMG explicitly allows DMs to determine what lore and setting exist in their games. There is only one way that the Forgotten Realms can assimilate anything, and that's if the DM wants it to. If the DM doesn't want it to, it simply does not.
It is like a cultural assimilation. There is no space left for diverse settings.
Except not. You can create a diverse setting if you want to.
 

Yaarel

Mind Mage
It doesn't. The DMG explicitly allows DMs to determine what lore and setting exist in their games. There is only one way that the Forgotten Realms can assimilate anything, and that's if the DM wants it to. If the DM doesn't want it to, it simply does not.

Except not. You can create a diverse setting if you want to.
The Forgotten Realms gods are problem. I have made herculean efforts to try create a setting without them. It isnt even possible to read the Players Handbook without them.

It is very difficult to create a setting, almost difficult to read any page of a core book, without in some way getting infected by the Forgotten Realms gods.

I found myself needing to rewrite the entire Players Handbook in order to get rid of the Forgotten Realms gods.

At that point, forget it.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
The Forgotten Realms gods are problem. I have made herculean efforts to try create a setting without them. It isnt even possible to read the Players Handbook without them.
I can have a setting without them in less than 2 seconds.
It is very difficult to create a setting, almost difficult to read any page of a core book, without in some way getting infected by the Forgotten Realms gods.
I can't change what's printed, but they only exist in your game if you want them there. End of story. If they exist in your game, it's because you chose to put them there.
I found myself needing to rewrite the entire Players Handbook in order to get rid of the Forgotten Realms gods.
That's not even possible. You literally don't need to change a word. You simply ignore any references to them since they don't exist in your world and you are done.
 

Yaarel

Mind Mage
I can have a setting without them in less than 2 seconds.

I can't change what's printed, but they only exist in your game if you want them there. End of story. If they exist in your game, it's because you chose to put them there.

That's not even possible. You literally don't need to change a word. You simply ignore any references to them since they don't exist in your world and you are done.
For me, when the player opens up the Players Handbook and sees the Forgotten Realms, the player is no longer in the head space of our worldbuilding setting.

The Players Handbook breaks immersion.

The Forgotten Realms gods infect everything and every setting.

Even the settings where they explicitly are unwelcome − Eberron and now Dark Sun.

The Forgotten Realms gods destroy gamer diversity.

The Forgotten Realms gods are an imperialist totalitarianism.

The Forgotten Realms gods infect every nook and cranny of D&D.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
For me, when the player opens up the Players Handbook and sees the Forgotten Realms, the player is no longer in the head space of our worldbuilding setting.

The Players Handbook breaks immersion.

The Forgotten Realms gods infect everything and every setting.

Even the settings where they explicitly are unwelcome − Eberron and now Dark Sun.

The Forgotten Realms gods destroy gamer diversity.

The Forgotten Realms gods are an imperialist totalitarianism.

The Forgotten Realms gods infect every nook and cranny of D&D.
All of that is literally your personal choice on the issue. 🤷‍♂️

I don't choose that, so none of it happens to me. None of the rest of can help what you choose, so at the very least, stop acting as if your choice is what is true for the 5e settings or the rest of us.
 

Hussar

Legend
For me, when the player opens up the Players Handbook and sees the Forgotten Realms, the player is no longer in the head space of our worldbuilding setting.

The Players Handbook breaks immersion.

The Forgotten Realms gods infect everything and every setting.

Even the settings where they explicitly are unwelcome − Eberron and now Dark Sun.

The Forgotten Realms gods destroy gamer diversity.

The Forgotten Realms gods are an imperialist totalitarianism.

The Forgotten Realms gods infect every nook and cranny of D&D.
Dude, that's just so hyperbolic that it is impossible to take you any sort of seriously.

#1 those Forgotten Realms gods? Yeah, they're not Forgotten Realms. They're Greyhawk. Seriously, Corelon, Lolth, Gruumsh? They are all 100% Greyhawk gods ported into Forgotten Realms.

#2 The FR gods aren't the issue. Planescape is the issue. Because Planescape was set up where no matter what setting you played on, as soon as you went into the planes you went into the Great Wheel. There is only the Great Wheel. There are no other cosmologies. So, every unique being existed as a singular unique being that appears in a bunch of different settings instead of being different versions of the same being. So, a Glabrezu is a Glabrezu. No matter what. Doesn't matter what setting you start on. You summon a demon, you get a Glabrezu that is 100% Planescape Appropriate.

Look, I get the urge to rant, but, good grief, this isn't even remotely productive.
 

Hussar

Legend
I mean, to a large extent it is true of every 5E product, yes. But Candlekeep avoids any geography, really.
Yeah, I'm going to disagree with this. I'm currently running Candlekeep Mysteries and I've gotten up to Curious Tale of Wisteria Vale, and virtually every adventure is pretty strongly tied to locations in Forgotten Realms. To the point where if you were to try to run these adventures outside of Forgotten Realms, you'd have a lot of work cut out for you. I mean, when you actually, literally, MEET FR gods in the adventure, it's pretty hard to claim that this isn't an FR adventure.
 

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