J.Quondam
CR 1/8
I'll have to try that! It looks so much easier than feeding them down the garbage disposal.
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The "I Didn't Comment in Another Thread" Thread
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Mad_Jack
Legend
I had to toss an inexpensive but rather nice knife once because I was ten feet from walking into a courthouse and had forgotten I had it in my pocket...
Now I'm wondering how long it'll be before somebody comes along and busts that thing open.
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
I had to get this off my chest, but couldn't post it in another thread. It's a huge rant about a controversial topic and I don't want to change the topic of this thread, so I'm going to spoiler it multiple times.
Over the past couple of years that I've been on this site, there have been quite a few discussions about the racism/sexism/other bigotry that's been in the hobby for decades. Many of these discussions have been around aspects of previous settings' lore and races, but some of them are about new additions to the game or other parts of 5e. A lot of this started after the Diversity and Dragons announcement and Tasha's Cauldron of Everything's "optional" changes to races in 5e (they were optional at the time, but quickly became the norm for all published 5e races after Tasha's).
And in every single one of these discussions talking about the problematic content in the game some of which absolutely exists and their existence is an irrefutable fact (I'm not saying that every claim that D&D is racist/sexist/bigoted is always right, I'm saying that there are times where it's undeniable that it is/was) . . . there have been people in each and every one of these discussions denying that the topic is a problem and that this specific aspect of D&D has absolutely nothing wrong with it and changing it is just because of internet outrage over nothing.
This has happened every single time in every discussion on this topic. And it is always the same handful or two of people that come into the threads and spout "This is fine" over and over again endlessly until the threads get shut down and the topics stop being discussed.
Every. Single. Time. Almost all of the same people (plus or minus a few that swing back and forth depending on the specifics of the topic).
It happened with Diversity and Dragons. It happened with the Tasha's controversy. It happened with Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft. It happened with basically every discussion of how D&D approaches different races/species. It happened with the Curse of Strahd and Tomb of Annihilation errata, where people were professing that there was absolutely nothing wrong with having Vistani be full of Romani caricaturized stereotypes and that it's perfectly fine to call the jungle continent filled with black people in the Forgotten Realms a "savage" land. Its happened with the NuTSR discussions, who literally have Nazis working for them. It even happened with the Orcs of Thar discussion, which is perhaps the most egregiously and aggressively racist official D&D product I've ever heard of.
The exact opposite happened with Radiant Citadel, where people heard that it was being made entirely by BIPOC and came out of the woodwork to spout that this was just an unnecessary PR move and that the book would be worse because of it (and the bright colors on the cover, let's not forget that tan suit of a scandal). The reverse happened with the Thaco the Clown discussion where the same people that were complaining other people were overly sensitive for noticing racism were losing their minds over a grumpy old clown being named after a near-universally mocked AD&D game mechanic.
And now it just happened with the Hadozee, where WotC themselves have publicly apologized for letting the issue through and admitted that they made a mistake. And they did the fastest errata in the history of D&D 5e.
Eventually, people get fed up with the BS. They realize that practically everyone that is demanding that the discussion not happen and that we ignore the parts of the game that appear to be problematic. They decide to take the word of people educated in this manner and ignore all of the people that are professing that there's absolutely nothing wrong and that we're just overly sensitive/"woke" idiots that think everything is racist/sexist/homophobic.
People learn that those that are always "skeptical" of racism/sexism/homophobia/transphobia are actually just bigoted apologists that don't want people to point out their bigotry. They're just trolls, and it gets really, really frustrating when they're not banned fast enough and end up polluting what could otherwise be constructive discussions.
And in every single one of these discussions talking about the problematic content in the game some of which absolutely exists and their existence is an irrefutable fact (I'm not saying that every claim that D&D is racist/sexist/bigoted is always right, I'm saying that there are times where it's undeniable that it is/was) . . . there have been people in each and every one of these discussions denying that the topic is a problem and that this specific aspect of D&D has absolutely nothing wrong with it and changing it is just because of internet outrage over nothing.
This has happened every single time in every discussion on this topic. And it is always the same handful or two of people that come into the threads and spout "This is fine" over and over again endlessly until the threads get shut down and the topics stop being discussed.
Every. Single. Time. Almost all of the same people (plus or minus a few that swing back and forth depending on the specifics of the topic).
It happened with Diversity and Dragons. It happened with the Tasha's controversy. It happened with Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft. It happened with basically every discussion of how D&D approaches different races/species. It happened with the Curse of Strahd and Tomb of Annihilation errata, where people were professing that there was absolutely nothing wrong with having Vistani be full of Romani caricaturized stereotypes and that it's perfectly fine to call the jungle continent filled with black people in the Forgotten Realms a "savage" land. Its happened with the NuTSR discussions, who literally have Nazis working for them. It even happened with the Orcs of Thar discussion, which is perhaps the most egregiously and aggressively racist official D&D product I've ever heard of.
The exact opposite happened with Radiant Citadel, where people heard that it was being made entirely by BIPOC and came out of the woodwork to spout that this was just an unnecessary PR move and that the book would be worse because of it (and the bright colors on the cover, let's not forget that tan suit of a scandal). The reverse happened with the Thaco the Clown discussion where the same people that were complaining other people were overly sensitive for noticing racism were losing their minds over a grumpy old clown being named after a near-universally mocked AD&D game mechanic.
And now it just happened with the Hadozee, where WotC themselves have publicly apologized for letting the issue through and admitted that they made a mistake. And they did the fastest errata in the history of D&D 5e.
Eventually, people get fed up with the BS. They realize that practically everyone that is demanding that the discussion not happen and that we ignore the parts of the game that appear to be problematic. They decide to take the word of people educated in this manner and ignore all of the people that are professing that there's absolutely nothing wrong and that we're just overly sensitive/"woke" idiots that think everything is racist/sexist/homophobic.
People learn that those that are always "skeptical" of racism/sexism/homophobia/transphobia are actually just bigoted apologists that don't want people to point out their bigotry. They're just trolls, and it gets really, really frustrating when they're not banned fast enough and end up polluting what could otherwise be constructive discussions.
As a person of color born in the 80s, this basically describes my experience just existing and experiencing race and racism, esp until age 18 or so. A lot of, "nothing to see here, that was all in the past, let's just move on." It's the default move, not just of outright racists, but also among the well intentioned, I think because listening becomes too uncomfortable.
I started a profile on this site and on reddit to try to engage people on these issues, because I grew frustrated with types of arguments people were making about the game. I try to ask the question: "ok, dnd is problematic, but we also love dnd, so what do we do?" A lot of my thoughts on mechanics actually stem from trying to answer this question; ironically, adopting an "old school" sensibility is one that allows you to hack it apart and put it back together, for free, without depending on either a profit-hungry corporation or racist grognards. That said, to actually think about the hobby at that level in an online forum is basically impossible. So probably wise to confine my thoughts to the pizza thread.
Benjamin Olson
Hero
Thank goodness they have the "Warning: Sharp Objects" sign.
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trappedslider
Legend
Safety first and btw it's in the UK
CleverNickName
Limit Break Dancing (He/They)
In that other thread, I was asked "who should hire the sensitivity consultant? this one guy that I'm blaming for writing insensitive content? or this other guy that I'm blaming?" and the weird part of this line of questioning is: I'm pretty sure the question was intended to be rhetorical.
Weird.
Weird.
trappedslider
Legend
this spoiler and something I've been wanting to say
Just because the controversial creator is dead, doesn't mean others aren't profiting from his creation and thus his views. But do go on consuming his creations in any manner, just don't @me if I consume from a living controversial creator. At this point is there ANY fandom that it's okay to be part of? I mean so far you aren't allowed to be loud about being part of the Harry Potter Fandom, any one of the fandoms created by Whedon, or Dan schneider's shows. The Star Trek fandom is iffy and so is the Star Wars one.
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