Tequila Sunrise
Adventurer
Welcome to the forum, and I can't wait to hear how your Sunday game turns out!
D&D 4E The New Monster Math, Explained and Expanded
Tequila Sunrise
Adventurer
Epiphany!
I was minionizing the deathjump spider from MV1, and wondering what to do with its 'death from above' recharge power. The power allows the deathjumper to jump 6 and then bite a PC. Obviously this power is largely what makes the deathjumper a skirmisher, so I don't want to just drop it. But I also don't want to be tracking recharge powers for a horde of minions.
Then I thought why track recharge powers, especially since they usually get used the same round they're recharged anyway? So I've invented a new type of power: the 'use or lose' power. For example, the minion deathjumper's 'death from above' says 'Usable on a 4, 5, or 6.' Meaning that the power is either usable or not usable on any given round, depending solely on a d6 roll. Use it or lose it; no saving the power for a later round. I'll probably roll a d6 for each group of 4 spiders...except maybe the first time. Rolling two handfuls of d6s right in front of the players tends to have a pleasing effect on them.
So what do you think? Brilliance, or something that you thought of years ago? Now that I've thought of this, it feels too simple to be original so I'm honestly not sure.
I was minionizing the deathjump spider from MV1, and wondering what to do with its 'death from above' recharge power. The power allows the deathjumper to jump 6 and then bite a PC. Obviously this power is largely what makes the deathjumper a skirmisher, so I don't want to just drop it. But I also don't want to be tracking recharge powers for a horde of minions.
Then I thought why track recharge powers, especially since they usually get used the same round they're recharged anyway? So I've invented a new type of power: the 'use or lose' power. For example, the minion deathjumper's 'death from above' says 'Usable on a 4, 5, or 6.' Meaning that the power is either usable or not usable on any given round, depending solely on a d6 roll. Use it or lose it; no saving the power for a later round. I'll probably roll a d6 for each group of 4 spiders...except maybe the first time. Rolling two handfuls of d6s right in front of the players tends to have a pleasing effect on them.
So what do you think? Brilliance, or something that you thought of years ago? Now that I've thought of this, it feels too simple to be original so I'm honestly not sure.
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the Jester
Legend
Epiphany!
I was minionizing the deathjump spider from MV1, and wondering what to do with its 'death from above' recharge power. Obviously this power is largely what makes the deathjumper a skirmisher, so I don't want to just drop it. But I also don't want to be tracking recharge powers for a horde of minions.
Then I thought why track recharge powers, especially since they usually get used the same round they're recharged anyway? So I've invented a new type of power: the 'use or lose' power. For example, the minion deathjumper's 'death from above' says 'Usable on a 4, 5, or 6.' Meaning that the power is either usable or not usable on any given round, depending solely on a d6 roll. Use it or lose it; no saving the power for a later round. I'll probably roll a d6 for each group of 4 spiders...except maybe the first time. Rolling two handfuls of d6s right in front of the players tends to have a pleasing effect on them.
So what do you think? Brilliance, or something that you thought of years ago? Now that I've thought of this, it feels too simple to be original so I'm honestly not sure.
I haven't seen this before and it strikes me as a great idea. Well done, sir- I may steal that for some creatures later on in my current 4e campaign!
(Psi)SeveredHead
Adventurer
That is an awesome idea; does anyone with math skills want to work out if that makes powers recharge less or more compared to what 4e normally does? (I think it'll be a tiny bit less.)
Tequila Sunrise
Adventurer
Well assuming you're not increasing from say, Recharge [6] to Use or Lose [5, 6], the former will likely get more use because 1) you don't have to roll to recharge on round one, and 2) it is occasionally useful to be able to 'hold' a power until the next round.
Unless I'm not understanding your question.
(Psi)SeveredHead
Adventurer
If you don't have to recharge on round one, then the math works perfectly. I'm going to use this next run session (probably in two weeks, but no promises) and report on my findings.
Tequila Sunrise
Adventurer
Looking forward to your report, Psi.
Just uploaded the new pdf, which includes Use or Lose guidelines and an ongoing damage chart. To make the chart work, I had to resort to non-multiples of 5, which might get annoying in play. Don't know, but I'd like to hear what others think about ongoing damage in non-multiples of 5.
Just uploaded the new pdf, which includes Use or Lose guidelines and an ongoing damage chart. To make the chart work, I had to resort to non-multiples of 5, which might get annoying in play. Don't know, but I'd like to hear what others think about ongoing damage in non-multiples of 5.
dammitbiscuit
First Post
UoL reduces the tendency of 4e combat to have a giant alpha strike on round 1 followed by tedium, so I really, really like it!
You don't have a free use of the power on t1, so the players don't have to sigh and watch the inevitable alpha strike happen to them.
You don't use the power on t1 necessarily, so the players quickly learn "Any given monster might have a trick or two up its sleeve that we haven't seen it use yet."
The 17% greater chance of rolling it generally improves the odds that the latter half of combat will have interesting or intense turns peppered throughout it. Caveat being that 4+ and 5+ recharge powers will largely become at-wills.
Has anyone made an app, script, or quick-reference spreadsheet out of this yet? I can't do an app or script, but I'm always happy to crack open a quick spreadsheet.
You don't have a free use of the power on t1, so the players don't have to sigh and watch the inevitable alpha strike happen to them.
You don't use the power on t1 necessarily, so the players quickly learn "Any given monster might have a trick or two up its sleeve that we haven't seen it use yet."
The 17% greater chance of rolling it generally improves the odds that the latter half of combat will have interesting or intense turns peppered throughout it. Caveat being that 4+ and 5+ recharge powers will largely become at-wills.
Has anyone made an app, script, or quick-reference spreadsheet out of this yet? I can't do an app or script, but I'm always happy to crack open a quick spreadsheet.
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Terrance888
First Post
RESULT OF SESSION
Our heros, having destroyed a Gnoll Scouting camp, are chasing down the survivors. After handily beating a skill challenge they catched up the survivors being debriefed by messangers. A quick battle results in the death of the survivors and the messangers being captured. Another skill challenge ensues as they interrogate their captives and then take a shortcut back to home base before darkness falls, having discovered the location of the Gnoll Warcamp.
Next day the Gnoll Warcamp comes and they strike its back, getting really good stealth and creating chaos before an organized response. They got through 2/3 of the camp, having killed the Gnoll Chief and saw on the other end an organized response, archers, skirmishers, barricades and such. Battered as they are (Leader tapped out of healing, all second winds used, 3/4 are bloodied) they intimidated the Gnolls to be cautious as they slayed the chief and high-tailed it out of there.
The monster maker works really well, although I'd prefer a quick refresher on the roles as Marvelous Monsters would have them work (since they are a bit different from traditional.) It did take a couple hours to update, save, crop and print the new versions. The Damages were high but not overpowering (to my pleasant surprise) and the combat was smoother with the changes and a good mix of minions.
Total there were 6000xp and some more to be given in 4 waves, of which my players defeated 3.5. 28 Minions, assorted lvl 6 Gnolls, 2 lvl 8 Leaders and an Elite lvl 8 Gnoll Warchief (Demonic Scourge Savage Berserker.) Everyone was happy with the encounter and the way the math works.
Thanks and good job!
Our heros, having destroyed a Gnoll Scouting camp, are chasing down the survivors. After handily beating a skill challenge they catched up the survivors being debriefed by messangers. A quick battle results in the death of the survivors and the messangers being captured. Another skill challenge ensues as they interrogate their captives and then take a shortcut back to home base before darkness falls, having discovered the location of the Gnoll Warcamp.
Next day the Gnoll Warcamp comes and they strike its back, getting really good stealth and creating chaos before an organized response. They got through 2/3 of the camp, having killed the Gnoll Chief and saw on the other end an organized response, archers, skirmishers, barricades and such. Battered as they are (Leader tapped out of healing, all second winds used, 3/4 are bloodied) they intimidated the Gnolls to be cautious as they slayed the chief and high-tailed it out of there.
The monster maker works really well, although I'd prefer a quick refresher on the roles as Marvelous Monsters would have them work (since they are a bit different from traditional.) It did take a couple hours to update, save, crop and print the new versions. The Damages were high but not overpowering (to my pleasant surprise) and the combat was smoother with the changes and a good mix of minions.
Total there were 6000xp and some more to be given in 4 waves, of which my players defeated 3.5. 28 Minions, assorted lvl 6 Gnolls, 2 lvl 8 Leaders and an Elite lvl 8 Gnoll Warchief (Demonic Scourge Savage Berserker.) Everyone was happy with the encounter and the way the math works.
Thanks and good job!
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