Too Complicated A Buy-In?

[Dannager]

A guide like:

New to Dnd?

As DM: buy xxx
As player: get xxx

like this site?

Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Home

p.s.: the link right now does not work for me... but it used to be a nice page, that listed exactly what products are useful for Players and DM´s respectively

can someone check, if it is a lokalization problem again or if this site is really down?

Or the info on the back of any core product?

Looking at the original PHB? It tells you on the back to get the Monster Manual and Dungeon Master's Guide.

Looking at the Monster Vault? It tells you that players need one of the Heroes books, and DMs need a Dungeon Master's Kit.

Where is the turmoil in this?

Also, yep, the site's still there, exactly as you describe it.

It's been ages since D&D was this easy to get into. Pick up a Starter Kit and they practically hold your hand from product to product until you've got a full grasp of everything D&D has to offer.

 

[Dannager]

Of course, you can start without many of the options--just get the PHB, DMG and MM, download the errata, and go. But would an interested potential player even get that far without some guidance? I don't see how.

Buy PHB. PHB tells you to buy MM and DMG. All three books tell you to go to Wizards' website for more stuff. A link to the rules updates is on the front page of the website, if they're so inclined. Not that they need to, though, since there's nothing stopping them from playing with just the PHB, MM and DMG, without any errata. And if there's someone complaining to them about the errata, chances are that person could provide the very guidance you're talking about.

 

[I'm A Banana]

LOL. Kudos to you for "beating the system," although I can imagine being annoyed if I was the B&N manager.

Hehe, well, I don't feel TOO much like I took advantage. We bought drinks and food in the cafe, I bought some writing supplies. The three of us there probably spent over $60, I think they got a good return on investment.

 

[Mercurius]

Hey, you could have bought the two Heroes books and Rules Compendium with $60!

 

[wedgeski]

Of course, you can start without many of the options--just get the PHB, DMG and MM, download the errata, and go. But would an interested potential player even get that far without some guidance? I don't see how.

A new player needs the PHB and a group. A new DM needs the core 3 and a group. Or any new player can pick up the Essentials handbooks and slide onto an Encounters table. *No* new player needs the errata, or even to know what the bloody word means.

How quickly the game has gone from "not enough options! this sucks!" to "too many options! woe! how is a new player *ever* to cope?"

 

[Dannager]

How quickly the game has gone from "not enough options! this sucks!" to "too many options! woe! how is a new player *ever* to cope?"

Yeah, pretty much this.

If you're worried that new players can't cope with the game, find someone who has never played before and ask them if they'd like to play D&D. You'll dispel your own fears and introduce someone new to the hobby. Win-win.

 

[MrGrenadine]

Buy PHB. PHB tells you to buy MM and DMG. All three books tell you to go to Wizards' website for more stuff. A link to the rules updates is on the front page of the website, if they're so inclined. Not that they need to, though, since there's nothing stopping them from playing with just the PHB, MM and DMG, without any errata. And if there's someone complaining to them about the errata, chances are that person could provide the very guidance you're talking about.

All true. But as an interested new player, looking at a whole shelf of books is daunting, and picking up the PHB (assuming there's one on the shelf) is like shooting in the dark.

And yes, I'm sure at the very least the staff at the store could help, but what could the downside be of having a clear, well marked on ramp, (something that the Red Box and Essentials were both supposed to do, but neither really hits the mark).

 

[MrGrenadine]

How quickly the game has gone from "not enough options! this sucks!" to "too many options! woe! how is a new player *ever* to cope?"

You quoted me before saying this, but just to be clear, I don't think there are too many options.

I think that the options should be clearly and logically organized to make it easy for a new player to jump right in. And right now, they're not.

 

[MrGrenadine]

It's been ages since D&D was this easy to get into. Pick up a Starter Kit and they practically hold your hand from product to product until you've got a full grasp of everything D&D has to offer.

Just a quick look at the forums here on ENWorld shows me that this isn't so.

And my own experience, of course. But I know I'm not the only one who thinks the game in its current state is cluttered and disorganized. Not unplayable. Not unfun. Just not organized, logical, clear.

I chalk it up to growing pains. Over time, the edges will smooth out.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Yes, the internet forums are no good place to look at...

however, in most threads you find your answer: essentials is the place to start. On the wizards site you find the right answer.

Would have a 5th edition maybe been better, a clear new start? Of course!
Does essential work as intended? Hell yes.

All classes are fitting quite well. They are quite easy to build. Not too many* choices and not too few**.

*In a 4e kind of way: I hope a 5th edition will once again allow you to select a class and play. Hey, you could easily strip many essentials classes down to 1 at will attack or basic attack (the one without choice, no feat and no skills chosen except where no choice is given and play some kind of level 0 character. And start from there...)

**from a new to DnD or coming from ADnD point of view...