What are the differences between 1e and 2e?
- Thread starter doseyclwn
- Start date
Eluvan
First Post
They basically just made 1E rules more complex with the addition of (supposedly optional) non-weapon proficiencies, class kits and so on. Also the assassin was removed as a base class (though later added as a thief kit), and bards were lowered to the realms of mere mortals. And some other stuff... it wasn't really that radical a change, certainly not as big as the shift from 2E to 3E, but there was still a vocal minority who hated it.
I don't have the specifics memorized like most of the other people on the boards, but the basic things I remember are:
1) No half-orcs as a race in the PH. PC half-orcs weren't introduced really utnil the Complete Book of Humanoids
2) No base assassin, barbarian, or monk class in the PH. Those classes were introduced later in the Complete Handbook series as "character kits".
3) Character Kits. Not part of the PH, but an add on the 2E "splat books". Basically, you added a kit (kind of like a template) onto your base class to make a really powerful character. The hindrances were usually role-playing hindrances only ("most people won't trust you..." type stuff) so many of them were unbalanced. They were great for idea generators, though.
4) The cleric was kind of replaced by the Priest, and that class was able to be modified depending on what god(s) or forces the character worshipped. So, while there was a heavy armor wearing guy wielding a mace as the cleric, there were also light armed and armored priests who worshipped different gods and had different bonuses and penalties.
5) Illusionists were in the PH, but this was the first time (to my recollection) that they also introduced (in the Complete Wizards Handbook) specialists for the other schools of magic.
6) Multi-classing and dual-classing was the same, pretty much.
7) The role for "non-weapon proficiencies" introduced in the 1E Oriental Adventures was greatly expanded to become almost essential (although I think it was still technically an "option").
8) Lots of stuff stayed the same - alignment, "good AC = low AC", I think they even kept THAC0.
9) No level titles.
That's all I can think of right now - I tended to concentrate on the differences in the races and classes for the most part when I read through the 2E PH.
1) No half-orcs as a race in the PH. PC half-orcs weren't introduced really utnil the Complete Book of Humanoids
2) No base assassin, barbarian, or monk class in the PH. Those classes were introduced later in the Complete Handbook series as "character kits".
3) Character Kits. Not part of the PH, but an add on the 2E "splat books". Basically, you added a kit (kind of like a template) onto your base class to make a really powerful character. The hindrances were usually role-playing hindrances only ("most people won't trust you..." type stuff) so many of them were unbalanced. They were great for idea generators, though.
4) The cleric was kind of replaced by the Priest, and that class was able to be modified depending on what god(s) or forces the character worshipped. So, while there was a heavy armor wearing guy wielding a mace as the cleric, there were also light armed and armored priests who worshipped different gods and had different bonuses and penalties.
5) Illusionists were in the PH, but this was the first time (to my recollection) that they also introduced (in the Complete Wizards Handbook) specialists for the other schools of magic.
6) Multi-classing and dual-classing was the same, pretty much.
7) The role for "non-weapon proficiencies" introduced in the 1E Oriental Adventures was greatly expanded to become almost essential (although I think it was still technically an "option").
8) Lots of stuff stayed the same - alignment, "good AC = low AC", I think they even kept THAC0.
9) No level titles.
That's all I can think of right now - I tended to concentrate on the differences in the races and classes for the most part when I read through the 2E PH.
Incenjucar
Legend
A note: Barbarians got their own book, and were a full class (like Ninjas, bwahaha!), just not until around the PS era.
The changes (this only considers the initial 2E core books compared to the full 1E system):
Races:
* Half-orc was removed from the game.
* Gnomes were given stat modifiers
* Maximum ages were lowered, in some cases (elves) dramatically.
* Level limits for demi-humans were significantly raised.
Classes:
* The Barbarian, Cavalier, Assassin, Monk and Thief-Acrobat were removed from the game.
* The Bard was utterly changed, becoming a base class: a minor magic-user with some rogue and song abilities.
* The Illusionist became a specialist wizard without a separate spell list (see Magic)
* The ranger changed drastically, becoming a two-weapon fighter with minor druidic spell ability.
Magic:
* Many spells (like Magic Missile and Fireball) were capped as to the maximum damage they could do.
* The Illusionist was folded into the Magic-User (now Wizard) class, spell lists were combined, and idea of specialist wizards was introduced for each school of magic. (Extra spells/day but some barred spells).
* The Cleric and Druid spells were combined, and broken into "spheres". Clerics and Druids had access certain spheres according to their class and beliefs.
* The Druid's "Heirophant" levels were included in their progression tables.
* The Ranger lost magic-user spells and changed what divine spells they had access to.
* The sale value of magic items was removed.
Proficiencies:
* Weapon specialisation was retained from UA, but double specialisation was removed and bow specialisation was weakened.
* Non-weapon proficiencies were moved from the WSG and DSG basically unchanged, although the presentation was clearer.
Combat:
* The weapons vs. armour tables were simplified and made optional.
* Initiative was now based on a d10 and greatly clarified.
* Surprise was now based on a d10 and greatly clarified.
* Instead of combat tables, the use of THAC0 was promoted
* A new unarmed combat system
* Other minor changes
Experience:
* XP was gained only for killing monsters, although story goals were also suggested (no XP for treasure or magic items).
Monsters:
* Giants and Dragons were significantly increased in power, along with a few other monsters.
Cheers!
Races:
* Half-orc was removed from the game.
* Gnomes were given stat modifiers
* Maximum ages were lowered, in some cases (elves) dramatically.
* Level limits for demi-humans were significantly raised.
Classes:
* The Barbarian, Cavalier, Assassin, Monk and Thief-Acrobat were removed from the game.
* The Bard was utterly changed, becoming a base class: a minor magic-user with some rogue and song abilities.
* The Illusionist became a specialist wizard without a separate spell list (see Magic)
* The ranger changed drastically, becoming a two-weapon fighter with minor druidic spell ability.
Magic:
* Many spells (like Magic Missile and Fireball) were capped as to the maximum damage they could do.
* The Illusionist was folded into the Magic-User (now Wizard) class, spell lists were combined, and idea of specialist wizards was introduced for each school of magic. (Extra spells/day but some barred spells).
* The Cleric and Druid spells were combined, and broken into "spheres". Clerics and Druids had access certain spheres according to their class and beliefs.
* The Druid's "Heirophant" levels were included in their progression tables.
* The Ranger lost magic-user spells and changed what divine spells they had access to.
* The sale value of magic items was removed.
Proficiencies:
* Weapon specialisation was retained from UA, but double specialisation was removed and bow specialisation was weakened.
* Non-weapon proficiencies were moved from the WSG and DSG basically unchanged, although the presentation was clearer.
Combat:
* The weapons vs. armour tables were simplified and made optional.
* Initiative was now based on a d10 and greatly clarified.
* Surprise was now based on a d10 and greatly clarified.
* Instead of combat tables, the use of THAC0 was promoted
* A new unarmed combat system
* Other minor changes
Experience:
* XP was gained only for killing monsters, although story goals were also suggested (no XP for treasure or magic items).
Monsters:
* Giants and Dragons were significantly increased in power, along with a few other monsters.
Cheers!
Last edited:
Particle_Man
Explorer
A few points:
1) I thought gnomes got an Int boost, not a Wis boost?
2) Monks were a core class in 1st ed, but were only a (frankly wimpy) Priest kit in 2nd ed.
3) Assassins had "death attack" in 1st ed, but the assassin kit simply granted better use with poisons and identifying poisons. Except in the complete book of humanoids where there was an assassin kit with death attack.
4) Psionicists existed as a class in one of the splat books in 2nd ed. In 1st ed, psionics happened only to characters of other classes (or monsters, of course) and you didn't get to choose it, but randomly rolled for the chance of it.
1) I thought gnomes got an Int boost, not a Wis boost?
2) Monks were a core class in 1st ed, but were only a (frankly wimpy) Priest kit in 2nd ed.
3) Assassins had "death attack" in 1st ed, but the assassin kit simply granted better use with poisons and identifying poisons. Except in the complete book of humanoids where there was an assassin kit with death attack.
4) Psionicists existed as a class in one of the splat books in 2nd ed. In 1st ed, psionics happened only to characters of other classes (or monsters, of course) and you didn't get to choose it, but randomly rolled for the chance of it.
Particle_Man
Explorer
Oh yeah, and paladins could be turned by high level evil clerics in 1st ed., but not 2nd ed. I remember that -- I played a 1st ed. paladin vs. an NPC evil cleric. grrrrr..... 
Similar Threads
AD6_gamerati_skyscraper
Recent & Upcoming Releases
-
April 16 2024 -
May 31 2024 -
June 3 2024 -
June 4 2024 -
June 18 2024 -
July 16 2024 -
September 17 2024 -
October 1 2024 -
November 12 2024 -
February 18 2025
