D&D 5E Unearthed Arcana: Gothic Lineages & New Race/Culture Distinction

The latest Unearthed Arcana contains the Dhampir, Reborn, and Hexblood races. The Dhampir is a half-vampire; the Hexblood is a character which has made a pact with a hag; and the Reborn is somebody brought back to life.

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Perhaps the bigger news is this declaration on how race is to be handled in future D&D books as it joins other games by stating that:

"...the race options in this article and in future D&D books lack the Ability Score Increase trait, the Language trait, the Alignment trait, and any other trait that is purely cultural. Racial traits henceforth reflect only the physical or magical realities of being a player character who’s a member of a particular lineage. Such traits include things like darkvision, a breath weapon (as in the dragonborn), or innate magical ability (as in the forest gnome). Such traits don’t include cultural characteristics, like language or training with a weapon or a tool, and the traits also don’t include an alignment suggestion, since alignment is a choice for each individual, not a characteristic shared by a lineage."

 

[Remathilis]

Wait ... a post that actually discusses the OP? Is that allowed?

I think gothic horror could be a fun addition to the D&D quiver. Ravenloft did it a bit, but that's it's own thing. Having something that applies a bit more broadly would be great. I'm not sure I'd allow these options for PCs or not because I'm not personally a big fan of tortured/anti-hero PCs for various reasons. On the other hand I do think they could make interesting NPCs.

So maybe an expansion of the concept of haunted environment from Tasha's? A guide to curses, especially ones that can't be removed easily? Anyway, a book that had more generic advice than a specific campaign could be a lot of fun.

Yeah, I'm thinking one part Heroes of Horror/Shadow, one part Libris Mortis/Open Grave with a Ravenloft overlay rather than a Domains of Dread type book. Generic, but with Ravenloft as the "example" or lore nuggets. Van Richten or Esmeralda would be a good "writer" for this, perhaps both with VR "commenting" on EDA's research Volo/Elminster style.

 

[TrickyDUK2]

I'm a bit late to the party, and I apologize for the post from a long ways back. Every time that I think that I am caught up, this thread seems to jump 20+ pages.

Ability score modifiers are IMHO the LEAST INTERESTING and LEAST MEANINGFUL way to express differences between ancestries. What is mechanically interesting to me with dwarves, for example, is not that they get +2 Con, but, rather, that they get advantage on poison saves, resistance to poison damage, and that hill dwarves get a bonus 1 HP per level. That expresses their hardy nature in a way more intrinsically than ASIs. I think that I would like to see more of stuff like this rather than a +2 Stat.

I appreciate, for example, how Pathfinder 2 separates out the biological from the cultural a bit more clearly too, including the possibility of having ancestries of different bioforms growing up and learning another ancestry's cultural training.


This is one thing, IMHO, that 4e did well. It gave every race an ability that keyed in on their trope: eladrin fey step, dwarven resilience and stand your ground, elven accuracy and wild step, etc.

I agree that ASIs aren’t the necessarily the best way to differentiate races, but Ability Scores are central to character design. If the default rule is just get +2 and +1 to place anywhere, then I can see that may actually limit creativity because this is a game and has certain ‘success‘ conditions and so why would anyone not simply put these bonuses in the score that increases their success chance, which would lead to pretty obvious choices? I remember when a game would encourage you to play some not obviously optimal for the narrative experience it could provide.

It‘s probably just me meta gaming too much, but I have been looking for game that tries to make optimisation less important. In D&D, the method behind the overall goal of character advancement, which enables the story to progress, creates a desire for some level of optimisation and this change feeds into that, and I feel that is a negative.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Yeah, I'm thinking one part Heroes of Horror/Shadow, one part Libris Mortis/Open Grave with a Ravenloft overlay rather than a Domains of Dread type book. Generic, but with Ravenloft as the "example" or lore nuggets. Van Richten or Esmeralda would be a good "writer" for this, perhaps both with VR "commenting" on EDA's research Volo/Elminster style.

I would see Van Richten as the primary writer, with Madam Eva making the critical comments. I see Esmeralda as more the sort of person who would write a guide to Keeping your Hand Crossbow well oiled.

 

[Aldarc]

I agree that ASIs aren’t the necessarily the best way to differentiate races, but Ability Scores are central to character design.

Ability Scores are central to character design, but I don't think that necessarily means or dictates that the only meaningful way for them to be expressed is through races or even races with un-variable ASIs. IMHO, there are better places to attach ASIs to character design than to races: e.g., Classes.

If the default rule is just get +2 and +1 to place anywhere, then I can see that may actually limit creativity because this is a game and has certain ‘success‘ conditions and so why would anyone not simply put these bonuses in the score that increases their success chance, which would lead to pretty obvious choices? I remember when a game would encourage you to play some not obviously optimal for the narrative experience it could provide.

Okay, so demonstrate to me how there is more creativity without the change, where people are inclined to pick from a more limited selection of optimal choice races?

It‘s probably just me meta gaming too much, but I have been looking for game that tries to make optimisation less important. In D&D, the method behind the overall goal of character advancement, which enables the story to progress, creates a desire for some level of optimisation and this change feeds into that, and I feel that is a negative.

I'm not sure if I agree with that assessment. If anything, I think that this change relieves pressure from optimization as it means that someone can pick a race without having to worry about whether it has the appropriate ASIs for the character build or concept.

 

[Remathilis]

I would see Van Richten as the primary writer, with Madam Eva making the critical comments. I see Esmeralda as more the sword of person who would write a guide to Keeping your Hand Crossbow well oiled.

I was thinking though having Esmeralda write it with VR commenting is manifold. It puts another female "writer" on the cover, one with Vistani heritage who can dispel some of the negative stereotypes about them. And VR already wrote a series of treatise on these topics, so he would play the role of "correcting" or adding to his former students work.

Though I guess VR/Eva could work, though they have a far more strained relationship than EDA and VR does.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I was thinking though having Esmeralda write it with VR commenting is manifold. It puts another female "writer" on the cover, one with Vistani heritage who can dispel some of the negative stereotypes about them. And VR already wrote a series of treatise on these topics, so he would play the role of "correcting" or adding to his former students work.

Though I guess VR/Eva could work, though they have a far more strained relationship than EDA and VR does.

The world is divided into two types of people: action heroes, and people who write about action heroes. Esmeralda seems to belong in the first category to me.

 

[TwoSix]

It‘s probably just me meta gaming too much, but I have been looking for game that tries to make optimisation less important. In D&D, the method behind the overall goal of character advancement, which enables the story to progress, creates a desire for some level of optimisation and this change feeds into that, and I feel that is a negative.

I think if you want optimization to be less important, I think you're looking for a game where character growth is essentially random or outside of the player's control. Or where the player's choices really only impact the narrative, and not the game mechanics.

 

[Umbran]

First, I had no idea 88 was seen as a nazi symbol.

Mod Note:

The man said - BACK TO BICKERING ABOUT RPGs.

 

[Aldarc]

I think if you want optimization to be less important, I think you're looking for a game where character growth is essentially random or outside of the player's control. Or where the player's choices really only impact the narrative, and not the game mechanics.

For games where optimization aren't as important, I'd look at games like Dungeon World, Fate, or Cortex Prime, games which as you say are more about narrative complications and choices rather than game mechanics and character builds. These are often games designed for the Hulk/Thor and Hawkeye/Black Widow, so to speak, to co-exist as equal contributors to the fiction. Or alternatively games like those in the OSR community that are less interested in PC builds and options, as OSR play typically emphasizes skilled player play over finding the answer on your character sheet.

 

[TwoSix]

For games where optimization aren't as important, I'd look at games like Dungeon World, Fate, or Cortex Prime, games which as you say are more about narrative complications and choices rather than game mechanics and character builds. These are often games designed for the Hulk/Thor and Hawkeye/Black Widow, so to speak, to co-exist as equal contributors to the fiction. Or alternatively games like those in the OSR community that are less interested in PC builds and options, as OSR play typically emphasizes skilled player play over finding the answer on your character sheet.

Yep, those were the exact sorts of games I was thinking of.

If you really wanted to stick with 5e, you could randomize stat growth and prevent character building by banning feats. Instead of getting to pick your ASI at 4th, 8th, etc, you roll 2 d6s and assign your +1's to whatever you roll. (1 = Str, 2= Dex, etc.)