D&D 5E Is 5E Special

[Minigiant]

Well, if the insinuation is we are biased, who isn’t?

That not what made this game popular and the things we liked apparently a lot of others did too. Ease of play! Choices!

the point is you aren't new to D&D like a huge chucks of 5e players.

In my experience, 5e is very very accessible to new players. It's inaccessible to new DMs if they want to do anything beyond basic premade modules. And these kids wantto do wacky stuff as DMs.

 

[Parmandur]

I also must say, that the DMs I played with did not take over because they did not like how I handled 5e. They took over because I had some time restraints and so I failed to deliver on the story side a bit.

Right now I do DM 5e Zeitgeist adventure path. It has some little added variant rules, but intrigue and investigation works perfectly fine with 5e, so it is an absolute blast. So thanks @Morrus.

I don't know anybody in real life who is didsatisfied with 5E, it's a pretty theoretical phenomenon for me. I'm the weirdo who wants to change things up with Classic Traveller or Vaesen on occasion while everyone else wants to keep on with 5E.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

One thought too many things used bonus actions, so he let a lot of things happen for free once a turn. Guess what happened.

Another thought too many things used concentration. Guess what happened.

"Warriors aren't cool enough." Fighters and Babrarians... i think... +30 feet walking speed, expertise on attacks, and add prof to AC and ad all physical saves

"2 free feats fr everyone. No restrictions" Guess what happened.

I am sorry, that you had such DMs.
Were tgey complete noobs or did they come from a different iteration of DnD?

I have seen 3.x edition players struggling the hardest with the ease of 5e play and DMing.

 

[Minigiant]

I am sorry, that you had such DMs.
Were tgey complete noobs or did they come from a different iteration of DnD?

I have seen 3.x edition players struggling the hardest with the ease of 5e play and DMing.

They weren't my DMs. I woulda told them their errors Session 0. I'm not a D&D noob.

They were near comeplete newbies except for 1. The one played in my game and told the others of their games with me.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It just seemed odd to me to say it as a criticism of the game itself.

That, combined with the talk of powers like they’re “buttons”, etc, comes across like a repetition of the worst arguments about 4e when it was in publication.

IME 5e stands up to that sort of thing a lot better previous wotc D&D editions. My memory of 2e is hazy, and I have only read older editions.

Besides, “DMs are more willing to employ houserules and allow homebrew” is a plus, not a problem.

I played 4e for its entire run, so I speak of experience, not unjustified prejudice. Maybe my choice of words provoked that reaction, but in the end, we did not look at the game as a part of fiction, but sadly, asmuch as we struggled against it, like a board game (a good one for what it is worth).
Essentials remedied a bit and breathed some fresh air into it, but when we did Gardmore Abbey, an especially great adventure, we played a whole day, but we did not feel lile progressing in the adventure. It was rather like a day of playing "Hero Quest". We had fun, but we decided to lay the adventure on Ice and 4e with it, because we wanted to play the story, not some great tactical game.

 

[Nightfly]

The only LFQW problem 5e could possibly have solved is "people like LFQW, we need to add some back in".

No clue what you mean by this, because Quadratic Wizards literally do not exist in 5e. As a reminder, the term "Quadratic Wizards" refers to the phenomenon of wizards getting more spell slots and those spells automatically upcasting. So when a wizard can cast Magic Missile three times as often, and the spell also starts doing double damage, now the wizard is doing six times as much damage and the martials can't keep up.

What I just described does not exist in 5e. Spells no longer become stronger at higher levels for free, and the concentration mechanic means that wizards can no longer fly and be invisible and have Otiluke's Resilient Sphere, etc. So yes, 5e solved the LFQW problem, and it did so without resorting to (for example) just outright leaving the Wish spell out of the game, as 4e did. In 5e wizards still have their god moments, as they should, but their steady single-target damage pales in comparison to what a martial can dish out, as it should.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

They weren't my DMs. I woulda told them their errors Session 0. I'm not a D&D noob.

They were near comeplete newbies except for 1. The one played in my game and told the others of their games with me.

This is really strange. Then what are their assumptions based on, that things should work different in the game as presented.

Maybe it needs some warning against houserules, as in the new monopoly rule book.
But I actually think there is a warning against removing concentration or allow a feature that allows to concenteate on two spells... but probably not prominent enough.

 

[Nightfly]

I played 4e for its entire run, so I speak of experience, not unjustified prejudice. Maybe my choice of words provoked that reaction, but in the end, we did not look at the game as a part of fiction, but sadly, asmuch as we struggled against it, like a board game (a good one for what it is worth).
Essentials remedied a bit and breathed some fresh air into it, but when we did Gardmore Abbey, an especially great adventure, we played a whole day, but we did not feel lile progressing in the adventure. It was rather like a day of playing "Hero Quest". We had fun, but we decided to lay the adventure on Ice and 4e with it, because we wanted to play the story, not some great tactical game.

This was my experience with 4e as well. I absolutely loved it at first, but the crunch kept crowding out the narrative aspects. It's a tough balance to strike between crunchiness and simplicity, and I think 5e does it quite well. Not perfectly, but nothing's perfect.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

You base your conclusion on a false premise.

The correct premise would be:
there can't be a perfect game for everyone.

So the conclusion you draw from the existence of LevelUp is flawed.

You admit, that 5e did what it was designed for: attracting new and old players. It was designed that way and works well enough for that.
LevelUp gives an alternative for people who want a bit more detailed game. That does in no way devalue the base game, but rather complements it.

I admit it was designed to attract old players.

I do not admit it was designed to attract new players. I think that was at best a distant secondary goal, and at worst a complete stroke of luck.

 

[Vaalingrade]

I have seen 3.x edition players struggling the hardest with the ease of 5e play and DMing.

Is the 'struggling with the ease of DMing' because it's just as, is not as hard as 3x?

The phony CR, multiple book monsters, and little guidance of 3x, plus you are the replacement for any actual rules.