log in or register to remove this ad

 

D&D 5E 20th level Sorcerer vs the world


log in or register to remove this ad

If the DM doesn't cap it at 20d6 as per RAW (average 70 damage) or if the Demigod is ever compelled to actually calculate in the HP loss from Magen making then the matter becomes fairly trivial to statistically kill him (or at least his simulacrum).
It has been established that at best he has 26 hit points, 2 HP + 24 for Inspire Leadership. On a really good day, he might have 61 HP, 2 + 35 expending an 8th level slot for Aid + 24 for Inspire Leadership.
 

Benjamin Olson

Adventurer
You still need to have the DM agrees that a drow political leader, coming for a society where intrigue and betrayal is the normal mode of doing politics, would AGREE (as the spell needs a consenting target) to let you cast a high-powered, unknown magic which you claim will make a servant, loyal to you, of HER likeness and knowledge. If your goal was to replace her with your servant and rule as a shadow advisor, you would do that exactly and abuse the guillible lady. It is totally out of characters for Drow Matron Mother to be gullible. It is a total use of "DM, pwease" to set up theses circumstances and to allow your convincing skill to let a DMM take a suicidal position.

The Drow Matron mother need not consent (though once again, simulacruming a lady without her permission is definitely all sorts of creepy). Since it is a touch spell, presumably he could even cast it through some sort of Wished for familiar. I wouldn't put it past him managing to pull it off once, before hightailing it out of whatever Drow citadel she lives in.

The real issue is that it is not a one and done deal. The Matron Mother simulacrum will "be instantly destroyed" as soon as he casts Simulacrum through Wish again, which, since he has his own simulacrum burning through magic all the time, will be every couple days.

The actual Matron Mother has to be the Sorcerer's live in house guest or at least somewhere he can get to every few days to touch her again.
 

@Hohige - I think your issue here is that you are trying to win so hard!

Enjoy the fact that you have come up with a really interesting and powerful build with a lot of very strong combos! But don't shift the goalposts when people work out a way to beat you. I've been following a lot, and that list of spells is certainly different from what it was several days ago.

Think of it this way - are you setting up the challenge, or not? Are you cleaver enough to overcome a challenge someone puts to you? I'm sure you think yes, and I suspect you are right... given a challenge you could come up with a cool solution to overcome it. BUT, I think you have let that cleverness slip into this game. In this game your Job is NOT to over come any challenge sent to you - you have to set the challenge that others have to overcome.

You've done that and it is good, but do you think that as well as coming up with an answer to anything reasonable someone challenges you with, you are able to come up with a challenge NOBODY else can beat? That would be hubris and pride. Don't run down that path.

You set a real tough challenge that was fun and interesting, and took a bunch of time to work out how to overcome. That sweet - that was your challenge, and it was cool. When people have missed the specifics it was okay pointing out how things didn't work. But when people have pointed out a way of overcoming, changing the challenge to "win" isn't correct. This isn't the game... that is you being a player and a challenge setter simultaneously. Be happy people have played the game and have fun because they have fun! You should go "sweet, that's a great solution. any other ways someone can overcome it?". Maybe you could go - okay that would work, I have lost. If we change the sorcerer in this way can we still overcome it?"

And the thing to note, loosing here isn't failure. The game is fun... but I'm pretty sure most players would agree any idea they had to "win" the game were not with unkilliable characters - we have not tried to make a character who is unkilliable (infact they were very killiable), just a character who could defeat your challenge.

TLDR:
  • You are cleaver enough to overcome a challenge when people put one to you
  • Be wise enough to let other people overcome your challenge when you have put one to them :)


As I mentioned before I think its a great build, and really strong - well done!
Blessings,
James
 

Benjamin Olson

Adventurer
It has been established that at best he has 26 hit points, 2 HP + 24 for Inspire Leadership. On a really good day, he might have 61 HP, 2 + 35 expending an 8th level slot for Aid + 24 for Inspire Leadership.

In that case: Any Level 20 Character with Simulacrum (or Wish), True Polymorph, and Invisibility.

1. Create Simulacrum. Have them ready.
2. Wait for Sorcerer and Entourage to fly by.
3. Simulacrum casts invisibility on self. You True Polymorph Simulacrum into CR 20 Ancient Brass Dragon.
4. Invisible Ancient Brass Dragon catches more or less entire group in:

Sleep Breath. The dragon exhales sleep gas in a 90-foot cone. Each creature in that area must succeed on a DC 21 Constitution saving throw or fall unconscious for 10 minutes. This effect ends for a creature if the creature takes damage or someone uses an action to wake it.

It would be more fun if the magens didn't have hover. But even with advantage saving against magical effects they will mostly fail and sleep through the fight.

With +9s on con saves, purported Demigods and simulacra thereof have a 55% chance of failing and falling 660 feet.

Naturally there can be another Invisible Ancient Brass Dragon along in a couple days to try again.
 

Hohige

Explorer
A new Demigod. 3 Powerful versions.


The Bastion of Law Demigod

1610643316157.png


Stats
Race: Mark of Shadow Elf (+1 CHA +2 DEX)
Classes: Clockwork Sorcerer 20
Stats (Point Buy): 8 STR / 10 DEX / 12 CON / 13 INT / 14 WIS / 15 CHA
ASIs: Skill Expert (Stealth +1Wis), Resilient (+1 Wis), Resilient (+1 int), +2 Int, Metamagic Adept
Final Stats: 8 STR / 12 DEX / 12 CON / 16 INT / 16 WIS / 16 CHA
Metamagic: Quicken, Distant, Subtle Extended, Empower, Twin

Saving Throw: +7 CON, +9 INT + 9 WIS + 9 CHA.

Trance of Order​

Starting at 14th level, you gain the ability to align your consciousness to the endless calculations of Mechanus. As a bonus action, you can enter this state for 1 minute. For the duration, attack rolls against you can't benefit from advantage, and whenever you make an attack roll, an ability check, or a saving throw, you can treat a roll of 9 or lower on the d20 as a 10.

Once you use this bonus action, you can't use it again until you finish a long rest, unless you spend 5 sorcery points to use it again.

He automatically wins every mental saving throw.

Stealth check: Pass without trace +13 stealth check +1d4 (Mark of Shadow)
With Trance of Order, It means 33~43+1d4 of Stealth check.


Final HP: 102+40 Tough feat +35 = 177 HP(Extended 8th Aid Spell ) +25 th Armor of Agathys +5d8 Bastion of Law. The Clockwork heal instantly 100 hp with his class feature.

Stealth Check:1d20. +10 Stealth (Pass without trace) +12 Expertise + 1 Dex +1d4 Mark of Shadow. With Magical Guidance to rerol.
With subtle spell, It's the most powerful stealth casting of the entire game. When you cast a subtle spell, It doesn't reveal you.
Extended Seeming avoid detection.

Wished Contingency condition: If the enemy detect me. (Casts Greater Invisibility).

Spell Known:

Spells
1 - Armor of Agathys, Absorb Elements, Mage Armor
2 - Aid Spell, Earth Bind, Pass without trace
3 - Counterspell, Dispel, non detection, Eruption Earth
4 - Dimention Door, Banishment
5 - Seeming Spell, Wall of Force, Skill Empowerment
6 - Freezing Sphere, Disintegrate, True Seeimg
7 - Etherealness, Reverse Gravity, Teleport, Plane Shift
8 - Demiplane
9 - Wish


Active spells: Twinned Simulacrum, Twinned Mind Blank, Extended Ethrealness (I'm invisible stalker), Subtle Pass without trace, extended aid, subtle armor of agathys.

edit: wrong spell slot, 5th level Skill Empowerment and Wall of Force for Clockwork list
 
Last edited:


The actual Matron Mother has to be the Sorcerer's live in house guest or at least somewhere he can get to every few days to touch her again.
So I guess we know where the 6 murder hobos hired by that unknown wizard hired in post #154, are doing. While the sorcer is out looking for Alfred and Binky, they are infiltrating the sorcerers fortress, rescuing the Drow Matron Mother and looking for that ridiculously powerful magic item the unknown wizard told them was in there.
 

Benjamin Olson

Adventurer
Spells
1 - Armor of Agathys, Absorb Elements, Mage Armor
2 - Aid Spell, Earth Bind, Pass without trace
3 - Counterspell, Dispel, Glyph of Warding, non detection, Eruption Earth
4 - Dimention Door,
5 - Seeming Spell, Wall of Force

This list can't be right. The Clockwork magic spells (two for each level 1 through 5) can only be traded for abjuration and transmutation spells of the same level, so any spell list for a Clockwork sorcerer without at least two abjuration or transmutation spells each for levels one through five is wrong.
 

Hohige

Explorer
This list can't be right. The Clockwork magic spells (two for each level 1 through 5) can only be traded for abjuration and transmutation spells of the same level, so any spell list for a Clockwork sorcerer without at least two abjuration or transmutation spells each for levels one through five is wrong.
This is normal spell know and extra spells together.
 

Zio_the_dark

The dark one :)
Epic
So, please write all your spell choices for each level and each spell swap as per the sorcerer ability when leveling up. From level 1 to 20!
 

In fact, I will take the first 6 murder hobos submitted, characters can be built using any WotC published rules, no UA. Characters must be 10th level, Multiclassing is allowed. Further character may choose, 1 Very Rare, 1 Rare, 2 Uncommon and 3 Common magic items. They also have 25,000 GP to spend on regular gear, the unknown wizard paid them half up front, half when they come back.

The game starts with, the sorcerer exits his Fortress and begins a campaign of destruction, the party follows the path of destruction back to the Fortress, What are you doing?
 

Hohige

Explorer
In fact, I will take the first 6 murder hobos submitted, characters can be built using any WotC published rules, no UA. Characters must be 10th level, Multiclassing is allowed. Further character may choose, 1 Very Rare, 1 Rare, 2 Uncommon and 3 Common magic items. They also have 25,000 GP to spend on regular gear, the unknown wizard paid them half up front, half when they come back.

The game starts with, the sorcerer exits his Fortress and begins a campaign of destruction, the party follows the path of destruction back to the Fortress, What are you doing?
Its great.
 

Ovinomancer

No flips for you!
Do you think we can make a build to make him die of falling damage?
Sure. 20d6 will isually get to 26 damage. Dispel followed by polymorph? Or just straight up polymorph -- 20d6 will get to 56hp more often than not, and 600+ ft is out of range for warding bond. Just pick something like a housecat so the form's hp doesn't mess it up.
 

In fact, I will take the first 6 murder hobos submitted, characters can be built using any WotC published rules, no UA. Characters must be 10th level, Multiclassing is allowed. Further character may choose, 1 Very Rare, 1 Rare, 2 Uncommon and 3 Common magic items. They also have 25,000 GP to spend on regular gear, the unknown wizard paid them half up front, half when they come back.

The game starts with, the sorcerer exits his Fortress and begins a campaign of destruction, the party follows the path of destruction back to the Fortress, What are you doing?
Make a party with all the demigod sorcerer build we get here, it should be enough to defeat a single of them! at 6 against 1 it is an usual encounter difficulty.
 

You're right. I'll take the bait.

Adapting to new information that HUN-HAT never ever goes below 600 ft of altitude out of fear of ranger (rangerophobia?)...


In the same setup that where the only way Alfred can learn about the existence of HUN-HAT is when he comes back from his Demiplane, but with Twinned Mind Blank (wished).

Alfred quickly realized this was so fun, to see this strange horde of two zombies (it was the first day after coming back from the Demiplane) led by Eilirilia, who had no meaningful flight capabilities. It's only by turning the scrying locator upward that he saw a few dots in the distance. He could barely identify 8 magen-looking creatures, two of them sprouting spectral wings... To add to Alfred's surprise, their noticing of the scrying locator put them in a rage and one of the winged ones ordered with a mighty shout Eilirilia to release the retriever and to the other to make a rampage along the general direction...

"This is too silly" Alfred tought. "This guy is a disgrace to magic... I must remove him out of charity, whoever he is... Maybe Ilmater wants me to put him out of his misery, so he can reincarnate as a proper wizard and lead a healthy, productive life?" But first, since Eilirilia doesn't seem in danger, and she is far from the enemy, I am under no hurry at all.

Alfred retired to his sanctum -- in the chronurgist mind, he felt a strange sense of déjà vu as if, elsewhere in the multiverse, this scene had already happened several times -- and opened a Gate a some yards in advance of the predictable path of the HUN-HAT's uncanny group.
According to his instructions, Butler 432 walked the path of extreme prejudice and crossed the gate.

He suspected that the winged magens were the main targets and would have elaborate plans and contingencies, conceived with fiendish cunning, in case of an attack. "What had Master said?", thought Butler, "ah yes, he asked me to take the winged morons down... but they don't look very threatening... Master will certainly have less explaining to do with Ilmater in the afterlife if only a modicum of force is used in this fight." So Butler decided to pull his punches.

Once the HUN-HAT arrived around 150ft and he felt there was a risk a lenient DM would rule the Search action for invisible beings can succeed at a range of 200 ft, more thanthe distance the magens can cover in a round, he decided to act. Covering the distance with his move, hasted and bonus action, he closed to 20ft of the winged magens. At this distance, he noticed one of them was an enchanted snowman like him, and the other was a Scourge Aasimar. Using his action, he unleashed TASHA'S HIDEOUS LAUGHTER, ready to expand Convergent Future to ensure the spell stuck (potentially using a Counterspell on his own).

While the main effect of Tasha's spell was to make the target laugh, it also incapacitated it. And this spelt doom for the HUN-HAT, because one of the limitation of the Angelic Form is that the wing retract whenever one's incapacitated. HUN-HAT proceeded to fall, incurring 20d6 of damage. Let's accept that despite the obvious nature of the simulacrum through truesight, Butler 432 decided to target the Simulacrum first.

The simulacrum, having half the HP of the original, boasts ONE HP, plus Aid (30 HP) and Inspiring Leader (24 HP), for a total of 55 HP. There is a 95% chance of him being killed on impact. No more simulacrum.

On the next day, Butler 433 reiterates the deal, bringing the HUN-HAT down. It might be possible statistically that Butler 434 and 435 have to be created and sent, but it is not really a problem. Alfred has monthes before HUN-HAT could become a problem.

After three or four days, Alfred has defeated HUN-HAT, from the comfort of his own home. HUN-HAT has been taken down, litteraly and figuratively, by level 1 spells.
 



Benjamin Olson

Adventurer
This is normal spell know and extra spells together.
No, because you do not have the appropriate number of extra spells of the right schools for levels 4 and 5. At level 4 you only have a single Conjuration spell, which is not a valid replacement for either of the Clockwork Magic Spells, both of which should still be there. At level 5 you have one of the Clockwork Magic spells, Wall of Force, but in place of the other you have Seeming, which is an Illusion Spell and so not a valid replacement for Clockwork Magic's Greater Restoration.

Once again, when you swap out a Clockwork Magic spell it has to be for an abjuration or transmutation spell of the same level, not higher, not lower.

Fortunately you are two spells short overall by my count, so you'll only have to drop one spell from the build.
 

Hohige

Explorer
No, because you do not have the appropriate number of extra spells of the right schools for levels 4 and 5. At level 4 you only have a single Conjuration spell, which is not a valid replacement for either of the Clockwork Magic Spells, both of which should still be there. At level 5 you have one of the Clockwork Magic spells, Wall of Force, but in place of the other you have Seeming, which is an Illusion Spell and so not a valid replacement for Clockwork Magic's Greater Restoration.

Once again, when you swap out a Clockwork Magic spell it has to be for an abjuration or transmutation spell of the same level, not higher, not lower.
You are right. It's correct now.
 

Advertisement2

Advertisement4

Top