D&D 4E 4e Save or Die?

[Mouseferatu]

And if you meet a medusa in a situation where you for some reason can't go back to town for a ritual to de-stone the victims (I'm looking hard at a certain published adventure here), some creative DM fudging will be necessary...

Not really. Check out the final entry in the medusa Lore section.

 

[Regicide]

Not really. Check out the final entry in the medusa Lore section.

So, if they have knowledge nature, and if they try to do the knowledge check, and if they get lucky enough to make the DC30....

 

[On Puget Sound]

Note that granting extra saves, if not accompanied by a bonus to the roll, may not be doing the medusa victim any favors; it just speeds up the resolution of whether the victim survives. My house rule is that a bonus save granted by a power or a player's action (eg a heal check) can only help; a failure will not make the condition worse.

 

[Mephistopheles]

They got rid of some of them, but some are still save or die; the two saves or die mechanic is still a save or die mechanic. Without modifiers you've got 11 in 20 chances of passing the first save, roughly 4 in 5 chances of failing the first save and then passing the second, and roughly 1 in 5 chances of failing both saves.

When considering those numbers, though, I think the style of 4E combat also needs to be considered: monsters take a lot of killing and players are likely to be hit with a lot more of the 4E style save or die effects over the course of the battle.

I've yet to come across any of these kinds of attacks as a player in 4E, but I imagine the two saves or die system will have a more tense feel in play. If you fail your first save you've got to stew on whether or not the next roll is going to be in your favour until your next turn - still just as arbitrary as before, but more of a build up than a single roll that's over and done with in a few seconds.

 

[Nebulous]

If i recall correctly (and i might be wrong), if a mind flayer has its tentacles on you at the start of a turn when you're Stunned, isn't your brain immediately sucked out?

 

[jorrit]

Note that granting extra saves, if not accompanied by a bonus to the roll, may not be doing the medusa victim any favors; it just speeds up the resolution of whether the victim survives. My house rule is that a bonus save granted by a power or a player's action (eg a heal check) can only help; a failure will not make the condition worse.

That's not a houserule. That's a rule. See PH2 on page 219. I quote:

Failed Saving Throw:Sometimes an effect changes as a target fails saving throws against it ... The effect doesn't change if the creature fails a saving throw against it at a time other than the end of its turn.

Greetings,

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

That's not a houserule. That's a rule. See PH2 on page 219. I quote:

Failed Saving Throw:Sometimes an effect changes as a target fails saving throws against it ... The effect doesn't change if the creature fails a saving throw against it at a time other than the end of its turn.

Greetings,

PHB2 stealth errata*? This one was overdue.

*)Not be confused with Stealtherrata.

 

[nnanji]

If i recall correctly (and i might be wrong), if a mind flayer has its tentacles on you at the start of a turn when you're Stunned, isn't your brain immediately sucked out?

No, in 4E they get an attack that they can only use vs. stunned opponents. If the damage from that attack reduces the victim to 0 hp or less, then their brain is eaten and they are immediately killed.

Basically, they don't get to use their death saves.

 

[On Puget Sound]

Well, it WAS a house rule...before PH2 came out. Hey, Wizards stole my house rule; where's my royalty check?

 

[Rel]

There is one that I can think of: Gravity.

If you are on a really high place, from which a fall would be fatal, and you take forced movement that would push/pull/slide you off the edge, you get to save. If you fail, you die.