6 months later: impressions of 4e

[dm4hire]

When 2e was being brought out I really just wanted them to take everything in 1e and streamline it and put it into fewer books or remove all the conflicting content between the different volumes. I wanted the same with 3e as there were still no real major differences in how combat worked. Once I saw 3e I liked what was changed, but my normal group continued playing 2e. Once 4e was announced I figured there was going to be major changes to it so took the approach that I would at least buy the core and see how it went from there. Actually I had contemplated just doing that and calling it good, leaving off buying everything. I liked 4e once I got a hold of it, but like I've said the longer you go with it the less user friendly it feels and I believe that's due to the lack of fluff. There's no incentive for reading the books for the sake of reading it. Perhaps part of this problem is that the first setting chosen to convert was FR which has always been heavy on fluff. I'm not sure it would have worked for Eberron starting off either as that setting was just starting to reallly get fleshed out before the change over. Maybe they should have just created a new campaign first to get a feel for publics reactions before launching into their more popular settings. I'm waiting to see if Eberron will have more fluff in it ( I know I said I wasn't buying it, but I'll still look at it on the shelf).

 

[BryonD]

It's better to say that 4e appeals to people who used 3e and found that it wasn't the right tool for their job.

No, that is absolutely not a better way of putting it.

 

[Lacyon]

Gothmog,

Your post adds just another drop of reinforcement to my opinion that 4e appeals to people who were not able to get everything out of 3E that was there to be had.

If we were able to get those things out of 3E, but find it easier to do so in 4E, how does that factor into your opinion?

I can drive nails through a plank of wood with the backside of a screwdriver, but it's nice to have a hammer.

 

[Giltonio_Santos]

I can change the system. I can't change the player...

I undestand your point, but what I was trying to say is that the playability that people want is there, but not at all levels, and that is fine.

Think of it as those websites with various features, and one of those is creating photo books.In my opinion, this feature is a plus, regardless of the ability of sight-impaired people to use it; they'll be able to use other features.

In that sense, 4E took the photo book out instead of improving other features available to sight-impaired people, and now they have a website that is not worth the effort for those who want photos. Like I said before, some will say this is a feature, but I see it as a bug.

Cheers,

 

[Fifth Element]

Your post adds just another drop of reinforcement to my opinion that 4e appeals to people who were not able to get everything out of 3E that was there to be had.

Wow, that's pretty presumptuous. The "not able" part makes this post seem especially elitist. It seems to read "if you don't like 3E, you're just not doing it right."

 

[Mallus]

No, that is absolutely not a better way of putting it.

Why not? Is the way I put it not insulting enough?

I think you should accept that 4e appeals to some people who are 3e "system masters", with considerable experience using 3e to produce a range of different campaigns/play experiences.

ie me and my group.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Why not? Is the way I put it not insulting enough?

If we want to put it that way...

People not enjoying 4E are not able to get everything out of 4E that is there to be had.

I think you should accept that 4e appeals to some people who are 3e "system masters", with considerable experience using 3e to produce a range of different campaigns/play experiences.

ie me and my group.

I would also count my group among "system masters". We were pretty good at min-maxing, had several campaigns going on and our DMs did venture into the higher level regions. But usually that was also the point where we had the biggest headaches... Well, actually mostly DMs.
Reminds me kinda of my Shadowrun 3e experience as a DM for 8 players or so. Wow, that was a headache, and it was maybe my second session as DM or so...

 

[jensun]

Why not? Is the way I put it not insulting enough?

I think you should accept that 4e appeals to some people who are 3e "system masters", with considerable experience using 3e to produce a range of different campaigns/play experiences.

ie me and my group.

Somehow I doubt that is likely to happen.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

Somehow I doubt that is likely to happen.

Why not?

I mean, the ease of running high-level campaigns and statting high-level foes alone ought to attract a large number of people with lots of 3E experience...

 

[WizarDru]

Why not?

I mean, the ease of running high-level campaigns and statting high-level foes alone ought to attract a large number of people with lots of 3E experience...

Maybe he means that it's not likely the BryonD is going to accept Mallus' suggestion.