D&D 5E A different take on Alignment

[Aldarc]

I'm just not seeing how a Chaotic character is (effectively) less charismatic than a Lawful one.

Star Wars: Anakin Skywalker is Chaotic. Djinn Djarin is Lawful.

HBO's Rome: Titus Pullo is Chaotic. Lucius Vorenus is Lawful.

MCU: Jessica Jones is Chaotic. Captain America is Lawful.

DCU: Aquaman is Chaotic. Superman is Lawful.

TWD: Darryl Dixon is Chaotic. Rick Grimes is Lawful.

American Dad: Roger the Alien is Chaotic. Stan Smith is Lawful.

Etc, etc etc.

The real world bears this out as well. The 'roguish, unconventional, impulsive' person is often more magnetic than the 'ordered, honorable, predictable' one.

Why stop there with giving this fictional characters (with multiple writers over generations) their Alignment? Why not also give them their MBTI type and Astrological Sign horoscope as well? They're both just as valid and substantial as Alignment to anything.

 

[Flamestrike]

Why stop there with giving this fictional characters (with multiple writers over generations) their Alignment?

Because alignment is useful shorthand that gets you in the ballpark for a NPC/ PC, plus (from a DnD perspective) its central to the underlying metaphysics of the game (the outer planes literally correspond to various alignments).

I could assign personality traits to fiction protagonists. People have written whole theses and psychological reports on how Dennis from Always Sunny is a sociopath, or what personality type Tony Soprano is.

When I see 'Anakin Skywalker; Male Human Jedi 7, Ace Pilot 2, Jedi Knight 4, CG' I have some idea of a general ballpark for the Character (he's unconventional and doesn't play by the rules, but a nice guy).

 

[Flamestrike]

 

[Aldarc]

Because alignment is useful shorthand that gets you in the ballpark for a NPC/ PC, plus (from a DnD perspective) its central to the underlying metaphysics of the game (the outer planes literally correspond to various alignments).

I could assign personality traits to fiction protagonists. People have written whole theses and psychological reports on how Dennis from Always Sunny is a sociopath, or what personality type Tony Soprano is.

When I see 'Anakin Skywalker; Male Human Jedi 7, Ace Pilot 2, Jedi Knight 4, CG' I have some idea of a general ballpark for the Character (he's unconventional and doesn't play by the rules, but a nice guy).

Yeah, and people who saw "Anakin Skywalker, Male Human Jedi 7, Ace Pilot 2, Jedi Knight 4, Sagittarius" would likewise see that as useful shorthand that somehow had a real cosmological and metaphysical level of importance.

 

[Maxperson]

A Chaotic Good society is pretty easy to imagine. It’s just a society in which autonomous collectives of individuals govern themselves according to mutually agreed upon methods and systems, wherein the method and system of rule is never allowed to become greater than the individual.

The U.S. is a good example of a Chaotic Good society. Huge portions of the laws and Constitution are written to protect the individual and individuality.

 

[Flamestrike]

Yeah, and people who saw "Anakin Skywalker, Male Human Jedi 7, Ace Pilot 2, Jedi Knight 4, Sagittarius" would likewise see that as useful shorthand that somehow had a real cosmological and metaphysical level of importance.

Well yeah. If 'Sagittarius' accurately described his general personality type, and also reflected an in game metaphysical truth, then it would be (doubly) useful.

'CG' tells me he generally doesn't play by the rules, and is generally a good guy, avoiding harming others and defending the innocent.

Which is a pretty good generalization for Anakin Skywalker.

It's like Vader. Knowing he's CE, tells me he generally doesnt play by the rules, and is generally a prick, who harms others and preys on the innocent.

From that 2 letter shorthand, I know that both are unlikely to keep their word, will generally twist or outright ignore orders, are unconventional, and unpredictable. I know that Anakin the Jedi avoids harming and killing others unless its in self defence of the defence of others, while Vader has no qualms about harming and killing.

 

[The Grassy Gnoll]

As David Mitchell said in the Nazi sketch, “Are...are we the baddies?” In other words, it is rare especially on the macro (societal) level for a person to believe (realise?) they are evil. Their actions are usually predicated on their view of what is good.
Law and Chaos is a staple from ... I think it’s Moorcock? But truthfully most societies are inherently lawful. The agreement that there are laws in place for the benefit of the many is inherently a lawful trait.
So most societies are, to themselves, lawful good.
Perhaps it might be better to declare an alignment in line with the clerical domains instead?

 

[Helldritch]

The U.S. is a good example of a Chaotic Good society. Huge portions of the laws and Constitution are written to protect the individual and individuality.

Never thought of America that way... I would have thought that it was a Lawful society but your point of view has a lot of merits...

So a chaotic good society would make zounds of laws to protect individual rights and liberties. A nice counter intuitive twist...

 

[Flamestrike]

So most societies are, to themselves, lawful good.

Alignment (DnD wise) isnt subjective.

One doesnt find themselves in Celestia on death simply because one genuinely believed themselves to be a lawful and good person.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The U.S. is a good example of a Chaotic Good society. Huge portions of the laws and Constitution are written to protect the individual and individuality.

In theory, sure. I’d say Lawful Neutral in reality, but I doubt we could dig into why without breaking the rules.

But your point is totally valid either way. A society where the laws exist to protect individual liberty above all, is Chaotic Good.