Angel 11-19 *SPOILERS*

dravot said:
That was a deception by the writers. We're led to believe that's why he's going there, but at one point we learn that he specifically asks for his soul.
I thought the words were 'make me the man I use to be' demons being like they are gave him his soul back to answer that wish, meaning be careful what you wish for, Spike the vampire was a demon with a chip, not a man.
 

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Spike pretty much put that debate to rest last night when he told Angel that the difference between them was that he had fought through the demon trials specifically to get his soul back, whereas Angel had had his soul forced on him.

Besides, Spike didn't need to get the chip removed at that point to kill Buffy since it wasn't registering her as human and he could hit her anyway.
 

RatPunk said:
Spike pretty much put that debate to rest last night when he told Angel that the difference between them was that he had fought through the demon trials specifically to get his soul back, whereas Angel had had his soul forced on him.

Besides, Spike didn't need to get the chip removed at that point to kill Buffy since it wasn't registering her as human and he could hit her anyway.
I thought it was more that he wanted to be able to rampage again. I know he wanted to give her "what she deserved", but I was under the impression that he wanted her to suffer before he killed her. In this case, suffering would mean playing with her by killing others around her.

Also, Spike saying that he got his soul intensionally doesn't mean that he did. It's not like he's going to taunt Angel with, "And I screwed up, too."

Of course, it does seem that the Writers That Be are trying to emphasize Spike's voluntary ensoulment, so I'm starting to believe that he was seeking a soul. This may be a case of the writers being too good at deception during Spike's trial.
 
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yes, spike asking for his soul back WAS the swerve.
We all (ok, some called it right,i didnt) assumed that he was trying to get the chip out but he really was trying to get his soul back.
yet another "fooled you, nyah nyah" moment from joss & co.
 

Plus, getting the chip out would not be as difficult as going through some demon trials. There was an episode of Buffy in the 5th season in which he kidnapped an Initiative surgeon to operate on his brain and remove the chip, and apparently this would have been successful except that the surgeon faked removing it.
 


That's odd, I specifically remember the line, "B---h is going to see a change," before going into the demon trials. Certainly doesn't seem like a search for redemption. *shrug* :)

Also, that surgeon said that he didn't think he had the skill to get the chip out.
 

Sharraunna said:
That's odd, I specifically remember the line, "B---h is going to see a change," before going into the demon trials. Certainly doesn't seem like a search for redemption. *shrug* :)

Also, that surgeon said that he didn't think he had the skill to get the chip out.
Just because he had a chip in his head didn't make him Riley. Abusive crappy boyfriends call their girlfriends things like that when they're angry. It just turned out he was more angry with himself than he was with Buffy.

That surgeon was probably trying to cover his butt. Some Initiative surgeon took it out eventually, so it's reasonable to assume anyone this guy had a chance.
 

I liked it overall, though I'm not a fan of Stumpy (though, he has two hands now.)

I'm also afraid of the absence of Wes, I hope it's not a Sign.

I liked Eve this episode, but her "betrayel" ruined any start of interest I had. I'm really starting to wonder about the Senior Partners. They seem as useless as the Powers That Be Absent.

I liked the Dew, funny.

Oh, and Spike should be the champion.
If the Souled Vampire will play a major part in the End, but his role is undecided, it can't really be Angel IMO. When he has a soul, he's good.

Spike is not so certain. I can see Souled Spike going to either side. (though, as stated, Hell on Earth isn't his cup of tea :)
 

Angel isn't necessarily Mr. Paladin when he has a soul. It was Angel, not Angelus, that told Holland Manners, "And yet, I just can't seem to care."

Buffy comes back, runs off to Vegas to marry Spike . . . ;)

As for last night's episode, I'm very happy I decided to avoid spoilers this year. That was good stuff.
 

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