Are gamers really that pathetic?

[WizarDru]

I suppose I can see your point Jester. I am just saying do not judge them for what they wear and enjoy. Someone wearing a Boba Fett costume everywhere they go would not bother me, but I admit I do not let many things bother me.

You're also not a defendant looking over at a jury that may be deciding about your future or your life or the prosecutor who's trying an important case, both of whom are thinking "can I trust this person, who may have trouble separating fantasy from reality, with judging a serious legal matter, possibly with lethal consequences?" Or they may be thinking "even if I win, Star Trek Fan over there is going to be grounds for an appeal or dismisal, if only because she has the appearance of poor judgement or possibly even a delusional state."

Imagine a funeral, where you've just buried your parents or your siblings, and in walks someone dressed like a celtic warrior with blue skin and runes...and you're of Chinese descent. How would you feel? Like maybe this moron was being disrespectful or even mocking the deceased? I would.

Some things are just not socially appropriate, IMHO.

 

[jester47]

I suppose I can see your point Jester. I am just saying do not judge them for what they wear and enjoy. Someone wearing a Boba Fett costume everywhere they go would not bother me, but I admit I do not let many things bother me.

Well, you might be able to get away with the Fett in a lot of places cause he looks cool and has the helmet covering the face, and lots of people know who it is. If its a place you pass through, then they probably assume you are on the way to some appropriate event. It also depends on the quality of the costume. But a lot of people would find a Fett at the symphony disturbing. Not because its some fan, but because it trips their warning lights in the back of thier minds. However a star fleet uniform might slip by ok. But but just even basicly wearing a costume around all the time, or to the high brow social functions, really does cheapen the costume experience... Like I love wearing my italian suit. It rocks! (I jokingly call it the assassin suit.). Now, if I had to wear one every day... I think I might not appreciate it so much... and there are certain places where a suit is not appropriate either. Its all about knowing what is appropriate when.

Aaron.

Aaron.

 

[Lichtenhart]

Galeros- Sure they can wear a costume in public, so long as it is appropriate. When it becomes inappropritae is when it starts to bother other people. And there are cases when they can wear a costume and it will bother people. Like at jury duty. Say I am a defendant or plaintif. I see some nut in a starfleet uniform in the jury box. It makes me worry cause I question her judgement. I don't wear my rowing uniform to formal occasions. Its a one piece spandex outfit. Its only appropritate when I am in the boat. Wearing it anywhere else will probably offend someone. In that case I AM bothering them. Walking to a con in your samurai costume is appropriate. Going to the opening of a non-sci-fi meuseum, or the symphony in your Bobba Fett costume is not. And that bothers people. And depending on the context it does hurt people, in that people that associate with that person are treated like that person. This is best seen in reactions to Leprosy. CPM/costume mans presence causes a leper reaction from the rest of the population. This reaction can be damaging: economicly (CPM and the game store) socially (trekker making a dubious jury) and physically (somtimes serious germs or fear of them). While the fear may seem irrational, its rooted in the rational. Simply put bad smells and strange dress signify danger in the animal kingdom. So how do you solve the problem? Go and try to convice large ammounts of people that their evolutionary instincts are wrong? Or convince CPM/costume man that his evolutionary instincts are right and he should listen to them? One is a whole lot less then 7 billion or whatever we are at now.

Aaron.

Ok I've had enough. I've seen this that was an interesting thread degenerate into a "I've met this nutcase..." "oh but I met this one other nutcase" contest, and I didn't say anything, but I can't stand things like this.

This is about freedom. People fought and died to defend the right to say, print, think and wear what they wanted, without having to pass someone elses' judgement of appropriateness.
There are laws that say when someone's dress offend someone and, for obvious reasons, they are all pretty much about nudity.
If what they wear is not against the law, you can find them pathetic, you can refuse to have anything to do with them, but you have to treat them like any other citizen.
If you're the defendant or the prosecutor and one of the jury comes in her starfleet uniform, you could ask her removed. But they probably did something you didn't do, they questioned her, while you judge her only based on how she dress. Maybe wearing her uniform simply reminds her that a future without crime, violence and corruption is possible, something that she wants to be reminded of while in jury duty, and even if she is a little weird, she is not clouded in her judgement.
I think americans still have a majority of people who are christians. What if tomorrow this majority deems inappropriate wearing hador, or the jewish hat (forgive me, I can't remember the actual name right now)?
This way freedom dies. I'd rather keep the weirdos in starfleet uniform and blue celtic paint, thanks.

I'm all with Galeros on this one.

 

[Incenjucar]

Clearly the nutcases who wear the Trek uniforms are in violation of the Prime Directive*, and are interfering with another culture by wearing their uniforms (remember, the away teams always play dress up if they deal with a backwards culture). What would captain (X) do?

*I haven't watched Trek for ages, so I'm not sure if I remember this right.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

This is about freedom. People fought and died to defend the right to say, print, think and wear what they wanted, without having to pass someone elses' judgement of appropriateness.
There are laws that say when someone's dress offend someone and, for obvious reasons, they are all pretty much about nudity.
If what they wear is not against the law, you can find them pathetic, you can refuse to have anything to do with them, but you have to treat them like any other citizen.
...
This way freedom dies. I'd rather keep the weirdos in starfleet uniform and blue celtic paint, thanks.

This has nothing to do with laws and limiting freedoms. This has to do with appropriate behavior and social expectation. You're using a tactic that I've seen a lot of gamers/sci-fi fans/etc. use when told they were behaving inappropriately: you're assuming the role of victim and calling people who have normal social expectations oppressive.

That's a load. Part of being an adult human being is having empathy for others and realizing when your behavior is inappropriate and/or damaging to the welfare of others.

Scenario: A wake. Bob's grandfather just died, and the family has gathered for the viewing. Everyone is dressed in the socially appropriate way, i.e. blacks and dark greys, modestly cut dresses and sober suits. Bob's secretary arrives wearing a low-cut red dress and heavy make-up. The widowed grandmother sees this and is mortified and offended at the audacity of this woman. The woman is ostracized by the funeral guests, and Bob arranges to have her transfered, because he can no longer stand the sight of her every day.

Who's the "victim"?

There isn't one. No one was assaulted, and anyone claiming to be victimized in this situation needs to grow up. That said, the grieving funeral-goers expect (and are in need of) certain social and emotional support. It is an accepted social norm that you show your grief, and therefore your solidarity with (and support for) the grieving, via your choice of garments for the occasion. Breaking those unspoken social rules is wildly inappropriate, rude, and indicative of a lack of empathy.

The courtroom example is similar. People are expected to show a certain level of professionalism, judgment, and tact. Decisions are being made that will change the course of people's lives. Your dress and demeanor are indications of your implicit understanding of the gravity of the situation. If it is inappropriate to wear a clown suit, then it is inappropriate to wear a Starfleet uniform. While it is reasonable to want to be "[reminded] that a future without crime, violence and corruption is possible" while in a jury, I would argue that anyone so completely unaware of the social situation surrounding her is, indeed, showing signs of clouded judgment. What that uniform means to her, personally, is a lot less important in a courtroom than what it means to the people around her, especially the people whose futures are being decided.

 

[Arnwyn]

This is about freedom. People fought and died to defend the right to say, print, think and wear what they wanted, without having to pass someone elses' judgement of appropriateness.

Complete and utter nonsense. "People fought and died to defend the right to say, print, think and wear what they wanted" without the worry of being imprisoned or killed.

Freedom from the judgement of Joe Citizen? Not bloody likely.

 

[Desdichado]

Complete and utter nonsense. "People fought and died to defend the right to say, print, think and wear what they wanted" without the worry of being imprisoned or killed.

Freedom from the judgement of Joe Citizen? Not bloody likely.

Not to mention the fact that a lecture to Americans on the sacrifices of their forefathers from an Italian is a bit odd...

 

[Lichtenhart]

Not to mention the fact that a lecture to Americans on the sacrifices of their forefathers from an Italian is a bit odd...

Oh yeah, I forgot that only american forefathers died for freedom.... :\

 

[Lichtenhart]

Who's the "victim"?

If you build your case this way, then there is no victim. But I could build a slightly different case where the red dress of the woman was very important to the deceased, and she thinks he would like to see her this way at his funeral. Then all the family of the deceased would be the insensitive ones.

Those unspoken social rules you speak about, are just that: unspoken. That means they could not be perfectly clear to everyone in the same way. what breaks them for you is not what breaks them for another. That is why our society is based on written rules.

If the people whose future is being decided finds a starfleet uniform offensive, they only have to ask their attorney to have her removed from the jury. And many people on jury duty could have much more clouded judgement than her, only they fall within your unspoken rules so you can't notice.

We live more and more in a multicultural society, in Italy and in the States alike. We are going to face more and more often people that we don't understand. We'd better adjust ourselves not to judge people so hastily, no good can come from this.

 

[Desdichado]

Oh yeah, I forgot that only american forefathers died for freedom.... :\

Heh. Not my implication there. Still, it's a misplaced rant anyway as arnwyn and Canis showed; if you understand freedom to mean "I can act like a complete jerk and a moron and nobody will judge me poorly for it" then that's certainly not the freedom my forefathers fought and died for.