Cry me a river 3.5E

[Ace]

Why buy them? Download!

Yep, the SRD will be up at the same time. Of course if thats not what you meant than

:gollum: thief thief we hates it forever :gollum:



I will probably buy the books (and the Monster Manual for sure) and use what I like.

Just like everybody else

Besides my next game is going to be grim-n-gritty w/o any blasting magic anyway

 

[Simulacrum]

What I do see is a lot of new campaigns starting, whether by choice or death. Some characters just will not be viable now. You talked about one or two special material weapons, that only works if you have a big two handed weapon, to bypass the damage threshold of the other DR's. Which invalidates archers, twf, small warriors the best they can get is a d8, and without massive change the monk. The haste spell being revised means if you didn't stock up on save or die spells your characters had it at high level and if the pit fiend is any example high end fights are now going to end in a character death. True you can be ressurected but how many times can that happen? So much for making it to epic level. You can't just go back and change spells and feats, and you certainly can't change your race.

Thats crap. Sorry but you underestimate the whole integrity of the system. The main idea is to challenge your players, make them go crazy about how to defeat a difficult situation and do it with tactics not brute strenght. If you really believe in what you posted above, I'm sorry to say, but you and your kind lack IIMAGINATION. Also not every creature will have D.R., this makes D.R. creatures better for climatic fights.
You see the changes are good because it creates more subtle possibilities and more intricate ways to challenge your players with.
If you are just do the compare this with that argumentation you are seriously missing what the game is truly about. Think about it.
The argument with the save or die spells is not viable at all. Lots of safe or die spells will be no more after the revision, those who stay CAN be still countered in the usual ways. period
Stop thinking in metagame terms, that will help. Also if you would see the whole thing out of the view from a very experienced (13 years) DM you'd see alot of things different to start with.
Some say the villians are *supposed to lose*, I say villians should be a challenge and there shouldn't be a singular way to defeat them all! Thats just plain bland... period

 

[kenjib]

Re: Re: Re: Cry me a river 3.5E

The game wont be anymore just about how high the + of your weapon is. Now its more clever to invest into special abilitys like holy or into materials like silver....it will change that problem alot.
Think about it. Weapons will have more special abilitys instead just + and some extra damage dice. That works out to the following: Magic items are capped by the maximum money a character can have, and to buy a silvered holy +1 weapon is GODDAMN EXPENSIVE! So you will have to choose what kind of weapon suits you best. its very unlikely someone has more than 2 weapons of that kind.

I dunno about that. Silvering something is a cantrip and blessing it is a first level spell. Does steel count as iron? Plus the DR values are going to be lowered, so if the DR is only 5 or 10, it's probably better to use a standard +5 uber-sword and suck up the DR rather than a +1 holysilver sword you keep in your caddy anyway. I also don't think this makes you *less* dependant on magic weapons. It just makes you more dependent on a larger number of magic weapons. It fixes the problem by introducing a new one.

 

[Tom Cashel]

It's the song that never ends....

Sings:

because it's the song that never ends!
It just goes on and on my friends...

Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
And now they'll keep on singing it forever

Just because

it's the song that never ends!
It just goes on and on my friends...

Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
And now they'll keep on singing it forever

Just because

it's the song that never ends!
It just goes on and on my friends...

Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
And now they'll keep on singing it forever

Just because...

Continue ad nauseum, ad absurdum.

 

[rangerjohn]

Well not all parties are the same, for instance there are only three players including the dm in my group. Not everybody is an expert tactician, and even if they were if they can out tactic that pit fiend who's meta-gaming? You say in that case run? Not all enemies can be escaped dragons and fiends in paticular. Let me put it this way what is a small warrior (halfling, gnome etc) supposed to do vs. 15/~ DR where they don't have the right material? You show me that I might be convinced.

 

[Psion]

Good lord. Heaven forbid people discuss perceived problems with the game. Occasionally it is constructive, you know, and leads to people finding solutions that work for them.

There are problems that people worried about in 3e that did come to pass in actual play (and some that didn't, BID), so I find all this moaining over moaning more impotent than the moaning that started it.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

I forsee mass instability, earthquakes, meteor strikes, floods, and famines!

I see much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

rangerjohn criticizes the moaning, and I can understand that. The problem is, though, that we were just now starting to pull away - at least a bit - from the almost continuous series of flame wars that erupted with the appearance of d20/3e. Anything and everything was criticized, incessantly and unceasingly, often obscuring more serious and/or pleasant discussions. I saw criticism, detailed criticism, of books that had not even appeared yet. In some cases, they were books that hadn't even been written. After a while it starts to wear away at one, until participating in an online community such as this loses the sense of fun it had. If some feel like lamenting what will surely be another round of all this with the advent of 3.5, try to understand.

 

[Nail]

....excessive troll-age snipped.....The main idea is to challenge your players...

Absolutely. I'm not sure anyone here says otherwise. But you've missed this part: Challenges come in all forms and difficulties. If the game is about fun, then the difficulty level is whatever you'd like it to be.

I'm sorry to say, but you and your kind lack IMAGINATION.

This sort of comment, and all the others you've included, are uncalled-for. Tone it down, bub.

Also if you would see the whole thing out of the view from a very experienced (13 years) DM you'd see alot of things different to start with.

Simulacrum, you're not gonna win much with that kind of claim. 'Round here the average age is 30 to 38...which means most people beat you in th' "experience" department.

Your rant about 3.5e nay-sayers is valid....but needs to be toned down a notch or two. Stop hyperventilating....it's bad fer th' health.

 

[Fevil]

Three words.

Download. The. SRD.

 

[Simulacrum]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Cry me a river 3.5E

I dunno about that. Silvering something is a cantrip and blessing it is a first level spell. Does steel count as iron? Plus the DR values are going to be lowered, so if the DR is only 5 or 10, it's probably better to use a standard +5 uber-sword and suck up the DR rather than a +1 holysilver sword you keep in your caddy anyway. I also don't think this makes you *less* dependant on magic weapons. It just makes you more dependent on a larger number of magic weapons. It fixes the problem by introducing a new one.

Nope silvering is not a cantrip, bless is not *holy*
bless is bless. (its divine but doesnt substitute the *holy* ability)
And steel doesnt pass as cold wrought iron...not even as iron alone....its steel.