E-Tools owners, please grade it

[RodneyThompson]

I gave E-Tools a D because it lacks features that I think are essential. If they added the following features, I'd probably give it a B:

• The ability to add new prestige classes
• The ability to use templates
• The ability to add new templates
• Formatted stat blocks
• The ability to add abilities that grant +1 caster level
• The ability to add new feats and have them able to modify more than just a few aspects of a character
• The ability to add new spell types
• The ability to switch between databases
• The ability to actually input a new spell without generating an error

I want to have the ability to do those things, and I don't think there's any reason to think these are unreasonable.

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

It's okay but its not going to change the way I game.

It's pretty good for generating stat blocks too. As a GM, I find that I need lots of these.

As a player, E-Tools isn't going to be all that helpful until it is able to be more easily added to.

As a DM, I'm using it extensively, however. I can live with possible errors in some monster stat blocks, since I can fix those (although a few are way off). I've used the race creation quite a bit, and I've statted up most of my NPC's using E-Tools for the past couple of game sessions. It saves me time, although I'm somewhat affected by lack of prestige classes at this point. I haven't experimented with modifying the database yet - I may download some of the stuff out there and give it a try this weekend.

I concur with those who are baffled at the lack of templates - that's inexcusable. Ability to modify classes and PrC's is a big deal, too, but I can accept that, considering all that this thing went through.

I don't understand complaints about pricing, however. I'm not aware of very many software apps out there that cost $29.99 off the bat. It seems very reasonable to me, and if it had had more features, I'd have gladly paid $50.

I hope that it sells well enough to get some official support, although I think the greatest value of this will come from user-created tools and additions.

Bottom Line: I use it.

 

[Vpenman]

Just moving this back to the first page to see how the ratings go.

 

[Vpenman]

Bumping back to first page. Last time.

 

[WayneLigon]

I give it a 'D'

1. No templates. Templates are an essencial part of the game, for creating encounters. This alone is enough to give it a 'D'.

2. I'm probably just stupid, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to create a custom encounter table, like the one on DMG136.

 

[Erithtotl]

This discussion puzzles me

I see a lot of people commenting how the e-tools don't measure up. I see some people talking about how what they want shouldn't be so hard to develop. I see other people defending the developers.

Defending the product by saying the design and team changed 3 times during the production process isn't a valid argument. Yes, this is a good defense for the development team, and if I was on that team I would probably say that. But it is not a valid excuse for a PRODUCT, or the company that releases that product. If you buy a product, any product, software or otherwise, and it doesn't provide the value you believe it should, you don't give a damn whether the company was having internal problems. Those are their problems, not the consumers.

The argument that these guys are game programmers and thus probably used the wrong tool for the job is again, only partially valid. First, if you're going to build a product, you better know HOW to build it. If Fluid got themselves into a bad situation by offering to develop a product that they weren't competant to develop, then thats their fault. Additionally, I'm sure they had some people on staff who now how to develop utility applications, or at least design them, and they could have brought in new employees (believe me, there are TONS of people looking for work or who would be willing to take this job in the market right now). Finally, it just ain't that hard to switch from C++ to C# .NET (I switched my entire development team from VB and SQL Server to C# and VB.Net and Oracle and rewrote our entire product in six months), but thats not even necissary as Microsoft Office apps and most other Windows applications are written in Visual C++, so the argument that it was the wrong tool for the job doesn't hold up. Additionally, there are some other products, like Delphi, which are well suited for building this sort of thing.

I have seen a lot of comments of 'Well, if you think its so easy why don't you build it yourself!'. That is ridiculous. Someone PAID the programmers of this software to develop a commercial product. You guys want to pool up half a million dollars between you and I'll happily write a superior program. When you're paid to produce a product, and it is your job, you are undoubtedly held to a higher standard.

I haven't used E-tools yet. I have used PCGen. And I've read reviews of E-tools. From what they've described, a small (say, 5 person) team of quality programmers could develop a superior application in a few months.

Taken on its own, it seems the tool is just the wrong thing for the market. Basically, the market for E-Tools is the same market as the people who bought the DM's guide. Any amount of market research probably would have shown that the average DM probably invests hundreds of dollars and even more hours on D&D. Given that, they should have realized that what DMs want is a more comprehensive product, even if that product costs $75 or more, rather than an extremely limited product that only costs $30. If we're willing to pay $40 for Forgotten Realms or the Epic Level Handbook, don't you think we're willing to pay a lot more than that to computerize the dozens of hours of tedious pen and paper preperation we have to go through? It seems they underestimated their market in addition to botching the product.

 

[Nightstorm]

arial

It brings me to tears of joy to see the people on this board wiseing up to the tragic thing called E-tools. I have been using Pc gen only to find out that at one time it had ALL the guidebooks feats,spells,Prestige classes in it until recently. Now Im not one to ask illigal things from others, BUT if anyone has the old downloads, could he/she please email me with it?

 

[Airwolf]

GPA updated

I just updated the GPA, see above, in case anyone still cares.



Regards,
Airwolf

 

[Breakdaddy]

I think etools lacks some very basic elements. The most glaring flaw I saw right when I fired it up and started making a human fighter 8 was the lack of multiple attacks being represented on the character sheet or statblock. Now I know that this has been fixed by fans since then, but it is only one of many problems that I found irksome and downright shameful. On a brighter note, Im glad to see that etools has some raving fanboys already.

 

[Hardhead]

Look Nightstorm, I've given PCGen a shot, but it's a hell of a lot harder to use and now days, they've been crippled to comply with the D20 License.

First, the current iteration of PCGen is *much* more usable than older ones. The GUI is nice and clean and mostly intuitive. You really ought to give it a try.

As for not having all the non-SRD stuff, that's true. It no longer has Sword and Fist in it, for instance, but hey. Neither does e-tools. Sure, you can use a fan-created database, but you can do that with PCGen too. And you can do it better.

Show me a fan-created add on for e-tools that has Monkey Grip in it. Go on, I dare you. It doesn't exist, because e-tools can't handle it. I have Monkey Grip working in PCGen right now.

Plus, to edit e-tools databases, you need MS Acess, a program a *lot* of people don't have. For PCGen, you just need a text editor.

In short, technically speaking PCGen is vastly superior. It can handle a far larger variety of feats than e-tools can.

It's more easily customizable. You don't need MS Acess, and you don't need to hand-tweak the database to get user-created stuff to show up on character sheets.

It's easier to use. This is a matter of opinion, obviously, but I feel the new iteration of PCGen is easier to use then e-tools. It has hover-help and everything.

And, of course, PCGen is free, while e-tools costs money.

So aside from the GUI, which is a matter of opinion, in what way does e-tools possibly outdo PCGen?