Excited for the future of the hobby

[Celtavian]

I think the extra options created by the 4E versus 3E rift is good for the game too. It gives different options we didn't have before. Before if D&D changed, you had no choice but to change with it or get no new material. Now with 4E for the people that wanted something different and Pathfinder for those that like D&D as it has been can both play and still obtain new material.

To me that is good for the hobby because there are different companies serving different segments of the same market. So that one segment doesn't have to leave the game they've played for years while the other segment takes the game in different directions and attracts gamers that might want a different style of play.

 

[Raven Crowking]

The OGL gives me hope for the hobby in the long term. Because of the OGL, there are games available that mean grognards do not have to adapt to the whims of 15-year-olds (as Snoweel indicated). Meanwhile, there are games out there that have adapted to those whims, and that is also good for the hobby. Win-win all around.

Of course, I haven't noticed any lack of people in their teens and early 20s willing to play at my table. Once more, I find myself with more players than I can easily accommodate. If my game isn't adapted to the whims of 15-year-olds, it seems to do well enough with 10-year-olds, 19-year-olds, and 20-year-olds.

I imagine that the same is going on at tables all over the world, whether the game be 4e, Pathfinder, OSRIC, OD&D, or Labyrinth Lord.

I am also quite happy with the new Cubicle 7 Doctor Who RPG, although I haven't had a chance to play it yet. The design is very clever, IMHO.

It is a good time to be a gamer.


RC

 

[tyrlaan]

Oh yeah, I agree. CRPG's can't compete but as I said, exposure is a big issue. What I was getting at is, a lot of older gamers have their opinions on badwrongfun and if a new gamer suggests anything against their idea you get lines like "DnD is about killing monsters and taking their stuff".

This comes from personal experience (since I started playing around 12-13) and the experiences of my teenage players to which we all agree, CRPG's do the job better for that style of play.

But the main problem here is exposure, with all these arguments about stats and class optimization and miniature support etc etc The beauty of TTRPG's gets lost in translation.

This isn't just my opinion though but the opinion of some of my players still in high school. I'm not sure if there are any that post here but it'd be interesting to hear from them.

I see what you're saying about exposure, but I wonder how much of an issue what you're talking about really is. Don't get me wrong, I do think what you're talking about doesn't help the image of TTRPGs. However, is that the first thing someone hears about regarding TTRPGs? I'm not sure I'm in any position to really answer that.

For my part, I can say I'd never talk to someone about all the nitty gritty stuff in attempts to nudge them to try out a TTRPG. As much as this is a great community here at ENWorld, I'd never suggest someone getting into the game come here (or the WotC forums) to learn more about the game. I'd expect it to produce the exact result you've spelled out.

I think the responsibility of cleaning up the translation so the beauty isn't lost lies squarely in the hands of the TTRPG industry itself, however. But I think the fishes to fry there are more in the lines of the "evils" of TTRPGs and the "geek" stigma, both of which are sadly still with us.

 

[Khairn]

The OGL gives me hope for the hobby in the long term. Because of the OGL, there are games available that mean grognards do not have to adapt to the whims of 15-year-olds (as Snoweel indicated). Meanwhile, there are games out there that have adapted to those whims, and that is also good for the hobby. Win-win all around.

Agreed.

I think that the arrival of 4E with its dramatic departure from the mechanics / flavor of 3E (and D20 OGL), made a lot of gamers reassess what they actually want in a game. And I think that we are seeing the results of that reassessment with new RPG's hitting the market. There is no doubt in my mind that D&D (being the 800 lb gorrilla that it is) needs to be the vehicle for attracting younger (new?) players to the game. I'm just excited that there are many gaming options available for everyone to enjoy.

 

[maddman75]

Agreed.

I think that the arrival of 4E with its dramatic departure from the mechanics / flavor of 3E (and D20 OGL), made a lot of gamers reassess what they actually want in a game. And I think that we are seeing the results of that reassessment with new RPG's hitting the market. There is no doubt in my mind that D&D (being the 800 lb gorrilla that it is) needs to be the vehicle for attracting younger (new?) players to the game. I'm just excited that there are many gaming options available for everyone to enjoy.

Agree completely. I think 4e's a neat game, but I'm glad there are people in the hobby, and options from 4e, to pathfinder, White Wolf's stuff, the indie games, the Warhammer lines, M&M, Savage worlds - there's something out there for everyone!

I've had great success building a network of gamers in my community, so locally at least we're in a golden age .

 

[Raven Crowking]

I think that the arrival of 4E with its dramatic departure from the mechanics / flavor of 3E (and D20 OGL), made a lot of gamers reassess what they actually want in a game.

This is true in my case, and is the primary reason I began to design an OGL game myself.



I kept looking at the design blogs, and kept thinking "This isn't what I want", but, not surprisingly, the deeper discussion of design issues that resulted pointed me in the direction I wished to go. So, I have 4e to thank for that!



I think that, the more games there are out there, the more we are able to pick and choose what we want, the better it is for gamers. Probably not what is best for the industry leader(s), but so be it. They have their interests to look after, and we have ours.




RC

 

[Hussar]

It's a funny thing.

Part of me wants the hobby to grow while another part doesn't want my game marketed at 15 year olds. I think selfish grognardism is natural but ultimately not good for the hobby.

I'd say for the hobby to grow it's going to have to lose some old fans and that's what's happening right now. Those of us who remain will have to adapt.



Sadly I think pen-and-paper RPGs might never catch on enough with the younger generation to make them truly viable, and D&D (and its imitators) could well die a slow death.

Computer games are just too bright, flashy and convenient.

When was D&D NOT marketted at 15 year olds? Let's see - Boxed set - 10+. Saturday morning cartoon - definitely the teen crowd. Ads on the back of comic books - teens. D&D computer games - teens. Artwork? Teen friendly. Themes in the game? PG, PG-13 at the outside. Novel series - definitely teen and YA fiction there.

So, at what point in time has D&D ever NOT been marketed to teens?

On a side note, I always love that Teen=computer gamer. Never mind all the statistics that say computer gamers are in their mid 20's. If anything, computer gamers are OLDER than TTRPG'ers on average.

 

[Pig Champion]

I see what you're saying about exposure, but I wonder how much of an issue what you're talking about really is. Don't get me wrong, I do think what you're talking about doesn't help the image of TTRPGs. However, is that the first thing someone hears about regarding TTRPGs? I'm not sure I'm in any position to really answer that.

I'm just spouting from my personal experience. I don't know every teenage or youthful gamer obviously but I know enough to give a vague outline of what troubles them but then again, that's only from an Australian standpoint as well.

I think the responsibility of cleaning up the translation so the beauty isn't lost lies squarely in the hands of the TTRPG industry itself, however. But I think the fishes to fry there are more in the lines of the "evils" of TTRPGs and the "geek" stigma, both of which are sadly still with us.

As do I. Although, I think you underestimate the attraction to being a "geek" in todays youth culture. Geekdom is very chic, very much hip at the moment.

 

[Kzach]

The OGL gives me hope for the hobby in the long term. Because of the OGL, there are games available that mean grognards do not have to adapt to the whims of 15-year-olds (as Snoweel indicated). Meanwhile, there are games out there that have adapted to those whims, and that is also good for the hobby. Win-win all around.

Veiled insults towards 4e and 4e players are so passe.

 

[MerricB]

What is it with Melbournian gamers crawling out of the woodwork lately? You're the second Melbournian I've noticed in two days and yet try and put a group together and you all go scurrying back to your burrows

I'll just taunt you from Ballarat with all my players here then.

Cheers!