D&D 5E [+] Explain RPG theory without using jargon

[Charlaquin]

My personal issue with Vampire is that it billed itself as a game of personal horror, but delivered a game of figuring out conspiracies and byzantine politics. Also for some reason it provided players with cool mechanical buttons, but then shamed them for caring about the cool mechanical buttons. Also bizarrely had an incredibly complex combat system that felt like a war game. Not to mention extremely shady instructions for the GM to keep players in line and railroad them through stories you have already written.

All very reasonable critiques! One of the reasons I preferred Requiem over Masquerade was that I felt it delivered on the promise of personal horror much better. It is still very much what you would call a high concept sim, and the culture of play is very Trad, but it simulates the horrific aspects much better than I think Masquerade did, and Second Edition added a lot of tools to help the ST build a story around the players’ interests. It also moved away from shaming the players for using their cool powers and towards making the use of the cool powers a tempting but dangerous thing.

I bought into all that for time. It was some of the most frustrating experiences I have ever had and not just gaming.

I actually adore the current edition which is far more transparent and provides hooks to make the game more about the player characters.

Yeah, I think they learned a lot from what other modern RPGs were doing, thank goodness.

 

[Charlaquin]

The beauty of Vampire was to never play as intended and just play The Matrix with Fangs.

I feel like that was the only way to make Masquerade work, yeah.

 

[Campbell]

I never played Vampire, but I played both the first and second editions of Mage: The Awakening. I enjoyed both, but I was probably a “bad player”. My characters always ended up suffering Wisdom loss. I figure what I was doing was thematically appropriate.

Yeah. I was basically playing my characters like stolen cars from the beginning. Then wondering why people got upset when my vampire did vampire things or when my samurai did samurai things in L5R.

 

[Charlaquin]

I never played Vampire, but I played both the first and second editions of Mage: The Awakening. I enjoyed both, but I was probably a “bad player”. My characters always ended up suffering Wisdom loss. I figure what I was doing was thematically appropriate.

You were absolutely doing what was thematically appropriate. CofD really zeroed-in on the personal horror themes WoD missed the mark on and built systems to support that. Especially with the 2nd edition, if you’re not struggling to manage your “integrity stat,” you’re probably doing something wrong.

 

[Charlaquin]

Yeah. I was basically playing my characters like stolen cars from the beginning.

I’ve heard this turn of phrase before but don’t understand it. Could you elaborate?

 

[Campbell]

I’ve heard this turn of phrase before but don’t understand it. Could you elaborate?

Basically creating characters with a strong dramatic need like catching up with the sire who abandoned them or getting revenge on the Scorpion Bushi who dishonorably killed your best friend in a duel and like going after that stuff hard. In Requiem Second Edition terms basically every moment thinking about how you can go after your aspirations. Playing the character hard basically.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

I feel like that was the only way to make Masquerade work, yeah.

Currently playing in a friend's whenever-we-can-all-meet-up W20 game, and yeah, this is pretty much how I approach the setting. It's grimdark bordering on crapdark, so I basically play it as Hippie Rage Monster Superheroes. Sort of hopepunk by way of Lawful Good? Which is a weird fit for WTA, but I've made it work and the guy running it is on board (though the occasionally-comical nature of the game means there have been a few laughs at my character's expense!)

Edit: Yeah, sounds like what @Campbell refers to as "playing my character like a stolen car." In my case, it's stupidly lofty goals of (a) healing the wounds and divisions between the surviving werewolf tribes, (b) restoring the lost tribes and lost fera, and (c) uniting the fera against the Wyrm to save the world. The storyteller even let me take a merit from Changeling: the Lost called "Higher Purpose," which is basically a positive version of the flaw "Driving Goal." My char strives to be a hero in a world that isn't supposed to permit heroes, and he goes HAM for redemption and second chances, unity and diplomacy, that sort of thing. It also helps that after the time we've been playing, he's a literal and metaphorical beast at both physical combat and inspirational/aspirational stuff.

 

[niklinna]

I’ve heard this turn of phrase before but don’t understand it. Could you elaborate?

The phrase always makes me think of the bit in Ferris Bueller's Day Off, where the garage attendants take Cameron's dad's car out for a wild joyride. To me it says, "Your character is not you (nor a vehicle you paid a lot of money for) and you don't need to have a stake in their wellbeing, so get out there and do as crazy as you like." You can crash and burn, there's always a new car to steal. (You can also bring the car back with no evidence of your joyride but the odometer, that's still an option.)

 

[HammerMan]

I feel like that was the only way to make Masquerade work, yeah.

Mage the matrix was a bit better but yes

 

[Charlaquin]

Currently playing in a friend's whenever-we-can-all-meet-up W20 game, and yeah, this is pretty much how I approach the setting. It's grimdark bordering on crapdark, so I basically play it as Hippie Rage Monster Superheroes. Sort of hopepunk by way of Lawful Good? Which is a weird fit for WTA, but I've made it work and the guy running it is on board (though the occasionally-comical nature of the game means there have been a few laughs at my character's expense!)

My impression of Apocalypse is that Hippie Rage Monster Superheroes is actually the intended mode of play there. At least, the Apocalypse players in my old Vampire troupe played it that way (though they called it “Fuzzy Captain Planet.”) But god, I feel like the already grimdark setting of apocalypse would only be even more depressing in the Year Of Our Lord Two-Thousand-and-Twenty-Two. I was always more into Forsaken. But I guess I could say “I like the CofD version better” of every splat.