Force Grip and dark side points

[El Mahdi]

Oh, man - if I were a Jedi, I'd want to kill all the time. Cut in front of me in line for coffeee? Force choke! Talking to loudly next to my desk at work? Jedi colon rip!

Yeeesssss! Embrace your Hate, and together we can rule the galaxy!

 

[daddystabz]

Luke wasn't a jedi when he did that. He did use the force, but he wasn't a jedi.

BUT Luke was being trained as a jedi by Obi-Wan and then later by Obi-Wan's force spirit AND remember that ALL characters can earn dark side points, not just jedi!

 

[ExploderWizard]

BUT Luke was being trained as a jedi by Obi-Wan and then later by Obi-Wan's force spirit AND remember that ALL characters can earn dark side points, not just jedi!

Ok I'll give you that. The biggest problem I had with Luke blowing up the death star (assuming every imperial in the place was twisted and evil) is the cellblocks full of captives!! The detention level was rather large and held more than Princess Leia. All those innocent lives snuffed out..............

 

[daddystabz]

That is a fantastic point and is one that should be considered by all in this argument.

 

[Obryn]

Don't use the Force to kill people, it's pretty inefficient for that. Use it for basic utility, speed, combat buffs, and defense.

You use a lightsaber to kill people. They have a lot better damage. In fact, it's practically impossible NOT to kill someone with one, since it lacks any setting other than "kill" (or "maim" if you waste a talent point).

Yoda wasn't stating any kind of moral philosophy, just good tactics.

In SWSE, the Force is way, way more powerful at low to mid levels.

Lightsaber? You might have a +6 to-hit and deal 2d8+something damage.

Force Slam? A cone, 6 squares long, +14 or so to hit, you knock 'em down if you hit, and still deal damage if you miss.

Versus any nonheroic characters, Force Slam wins handily.

IMHO, it's the system's main flaw. I try to counter it with DSPs - namely, if you use the force too often for harming people, you get the DSP smackdown.

-O

 

[Remus Lupin]

Well, it seems to me that one way to aid in this is to give the Jedi the option to use force powers to stun, rather than to do direct damage. So, in the case of Force Slam, the Jedi could be allowed to use it instead to knock his opponents down the condition track until they're unconscious.

Certainly, if you're going to give out DSP for using these powers offensively, there ought to be an option to convert it to non-lethal damage.

 

[Ginnel]

That is a fantastic point and is one that should be considered by all in this argument.

Hey this isn't an argument man, chill

This is you presenting your opinion and your DM's opinion and now us forum lot are offering opinions, debate is a much more relevent word.

its been said by a poster before it does look like your trying to use this forum to prove your DM wrong, I don't think its going to work, it sounds like your DM explained how the force and dark side points worked at the start, but now after playing a bit feels like it would be better for the game if dark side points were easier to get.

If your going to try and get your point across explain how this ruling on dark side points would make the game worse for the entire group not just yourself, including non force users in the group who may be getting overshadowed by the jedi.

Having said that I think Luke was pretty much a grey jedi not light side or dark, after blowing up the death star, killing the dark lords of the sith very good! killing thousands of innocents not so good.

 

[Starbuck_II]

I personally try to avoid any damage dealing Force use just in case DM tries to givea Dark point:

So ArcTan my Ewok Jedi uses:
2x Negate Energy (Blocks almost any damage except bullets))
1 x Vital transfer (Healing!)
1x Force Stun (knocks out most animals/some people since DM uses versus Will instead of Fort like Errata))
1x Surge (Ewoks are slow)
2x Rebuke (blocks force used against me)
2 x battle Strike (makes Lightsaber deal good damage)

Personally, unless using Force Choke to kill a non-enemy/torture I find it shouldn't give DPs. But then again, I avoid damage ones.

 

[daddystabz]

Hey this isn't an argument man, chill

This is you presenting your opinion and your DM's opinion and now us forum lot are offering opinions, debate is a much more relevent word.

its been said by a poster before it does look like your trying to use this forum to prove your DM wrong, I don't think its going to work, it sounds like your DM explained how the force and dark side points worked at the start, but now after playing a bit feels like it would be better for the game if dark side points were easier to get.

If your going to try and get your point across explain how this ruling on dark side points would make the game worse for the entire group not just yourself, including non force users in the group who may be getting overshadowed by the jedi.

Having said that I think Luke was pretty much a grey jedi not light side or dark, after blowing up the death star, killing the dark lords of the sith very good! killing thousands of innocents not so good.

First of all, I do not see this as an argument in the traditional sense of the word. A better word to use there and closer to what I really meant was debate. In addition, if you go back and reread what I said earlier about why I brought this all up, you will find that I have rarely used Force Grip in our game and our GM has NEVER given out a dark side point yet. He started reading the transgressions part of the core rulebook last week and decided he was being too lenient. He had concerns mostly in regard to another player/jedi in our group that has a tendency to go crazy with his force powers. In one of our gaming sessions he famously went crazy with the force and lifted a Z-95 Headhunter starship and dropped it on Durga the Hutt, killing him. This was deemed an unnecessary action but he was not given a dark side point. I think the GM would be justified to give one in this case. However, using force grip in an intense situation to save my friends and myself from attackers I feel should NOT receive a dark side point. If I use it blatantly, going overboard with it, or maintaining it round for round on an enemy or using it on an enemy already at my mercy or one that is fleeing then I agree that it would then warrant a dark side point.