Gaining Dex as bonus damage for a finessable weapon...

[Storyteller01]

I asked this earlier during a thread about improving twf characters, and would like some feed back from you's guys.

I was thinking about (I still play 3.0 folks) creating a feat that allowed those who had taken Weapons Finesse to use their Dex bonus as extra damage for that weapon, rather than strength.

My main stipulation would be the this damage does not stack with Power Attack or similar feats, as (feat to be named later) relies on precision, where as Power Attack is about doing incredible amounts of damage IF you hit.

Any ides for a name as well?

WARNING : Please folks, no flaming about the differences in Weapons Finesse in 3.0/3.5. I prefer the 3.0 rules because of experience. A dagger is not handled the same as a rapier or a shortsword, etc. My game, my house rules. YMMV


Thanks for your help.

 

[Wystan]

Improved Weapon Finesse:
Allows Dex to be used for Damage as well.

However it stacks with all other Feats.... So Power Attack would be like trying your hardest to hit them in the spot covered by their arm that you know whould do the most damage....You can handwave anything with a little rhetoric...

 

[TheYeti1775]

Precision Attack

A DM and I made it as a twin to power attack, and only one could be applied. Weapon Finesse was a Prereq to it. And it was added to the Fighter Bonus Feat list.

It would also take the place of Power Attack as a Prereq for Cleave, since quick strikes can carry through just the same as a powerful strike through.

I used it with a Rogue/Mage that wielded a Rapier, sometimes Rapier/Dagger combo. Worked out fairly well in play.

 

[Stalker0]

I personally think its too good. A str fighter can't totally ignore dex, as it does help their AC and reflex saves. But with this, a dex fighter can pretty much completely ignore str...which I don't think is a good idea.

 

[Storyteller01]

I was thining that the balance would be the fighter's susspetibility to Dex draining attacks or spells. Is this too unlikely to accure?

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Imp Finesse

I see no problem with such a feat, even if it goes as far as acting as a prereq for Cleave instead of Power Attack.

The key balancing factor would be that you can only use it with Finessable weapons...

Yes, a full Dex fighter could virtually ignore Str.. much as a Monk can focus on WIS to the neglect of other stats. The trade off being use of lighter weapons {less damage} and lighter armor {less AC}.

Not too bad for the cost of 2 feats.

In Kenneth Hood's Grim-n-Gritty system, he proposed an optional rule where all attacks are Dex based, and Weapon Finesse is changed to the Imp Weapon Finesse above. He also has a Brutish Attack which allows you to use STR bonus to attacks with two handed weapons.
Makes an interesting change to the balance of the game, but not one that is overpowerfully unbalancing.

 

[Storyteller01]

The key balancing factor would be that you can only use it with Finessable weapons...

There is that too...

 

[TheYeti1775]

True, but (there's always a but...)

True, but look at it this way.
Your armor's restrict the Dex Bonus allowed for Armor right. Have that restriction in place for this feat's use as well. That and with a low strength, they couldn't carry as much anyways.

So you can go: (Figure same level and same styles for this comparssion)
Dex Fighter = Light to No Armor to gain true benifit.
10 Str
18 Dex
Chain Shirt (+4 to AC/Max Dex of 4) without anything else will have an AC of 18.

Str Fighter = your tanks, heavy armor.
18 Str
10 Dex
Full Plate (+8 to AC/Max Dex of 1) without anything else will have an AC of 18.

So AC-wise they are the same realistically.
Their To Hits would be the same now, one using Weapon Finese.
So a Dex fighter has spent one feat to have the same chance to Hit.
Damage-wise the Dex fighter would have to spend another feat (the Prec. Attack) to do the same amount of damage.
So the cost is two feats to stand on even ground with the Str Fighter. Even for Fighters this is not a small price to pay for a fighting style.

So it really falls into style of play. If you want real life examples look at feudal Japan's Samurai's. Their fighting styles were one of quick precise attacks, where as the majority of western Europes was the bashing till their pulp style. Both are proven effective, there are advantages to both and disadvantages to both. That's the way I see it.

 

[Storyteller01]

It would also take the place of Power Attack as a Prereq for Cleave, since quick strikes can carry through just the same as a powerful strike through.

OOooooo..... I DO like that idea!

 

[HellHound]

Personally, I find Dex to be too important already, and this will make it more so - also, I have some difficulty seeing how a hgih Dex would improve damage... I would be far more open to a feat that allowed Int to be substituted for Strength in these cases instead of Dex. More in line with Villains & Vigilantes, if you will.