D&D 5E GWM+Longbow

[Paul Farquhar]

I think we are overlooking a key bit of text here - “An object that bears no resemblance to a weapon". An unstrung longbow stave is very similar to a quarterstaff, and archers would have used their bows as such if forced into melee. (wouldn't be much use as a bow afterwards though).

NB D&D art often depicts longbows a bit on the small side.

Quarterstaffs do not have the "heavy" property.

 

[Horwath]

In Races of the Wild, a 3.5e book, you could make your longbow "Elvencrafted". That would treat your bow as a quarterstaff for melee combat.
It is not heavy, but you would be proficient with it and have normal attack roll.

 

[Dausuul]

Edit: Never mind, not applicable.

 

[the Jester]

Jeez y'all...

Not everyone sees Crawford's tweets as very convincing, regardless of WotC's official stance on a given day. His "roll 1d4+1 and it's for all of your magic missiles" post alone removed all his credibility as a rules guru for some people, just to post one example.

That said, in this case, I agree with him- and I find the "loading" argument to be particularly persuasive.

 

[BookBarbarian]

Orrrr... he had the tavern brawler feat and a high strength

As a practiced Warbow Archer he would certainly have a high strength (not that that is modeled in D&D)

 

[Umbran]

Mod Note:

Folks, it is not a good look to get snippy at each other over exactly what fantasy game bonus you get for whacking someone with a stick that isn't deisgned for that kind of whacking. How about respect come before the stake in the ground over rules interpretations, hm?

 

[Charlaquin]

the improvised weapon rules state everything that an improvised weapons is and can do. Every weapon type does the same. Improvised weapon does NOT say it keeps traits when a ranged weapon is used in melee.

otherwise a crossbow used as a improvised weapon would have the loading quality and would need to be reloaded before making another melee attack with it.

And what are the traits of an improvised weapon?
1d4+str, ability to be thrown at a range of 20/60.

that’s it.
Specifically: “An object that bears no resemblance to a weapon deals 1d4 damage (the DM assigns a damage type appropriate to the object). If a character uses a ranged weapon to make a melee attack, or throws a melee weapon that does not have the thrown property, it also deals 1d4 damage. An improvised thrown weapon has a normal range of 20 feet and a long range of 60 feet. “

unless you’d like to argue that a crossbow needs to be reloaded before used again as an improvised melee weapon then your argument doesn’t hold water. You can’t pick and choose if you think qualities carry over. Regardless, 5e is specific- what a rule says is what happens. If it isn’t in there, then it doesn’t exist. And nowhere in improvised weapons does it state that it transfers existing qualities from the base weapon when using ranged in melee

The Loading property wouldn’t interfere with using a crossbow to make a melee attack.

Loading
Because of the time required to load this weapon, you can fire only one piece of Ammunition from it when you use an action, Bonus Action, or Reaction to fire it, regardless of the number of attacks you can normally make.

Since making a melee attack with a ranged weapon does not require you to fire a piece of ammunition from it, the Loading property does not prevent you from doing so multiple times in a turn.

 

[Charlaquin]

So that you can take both GWM and Sharpshooter and use both for -10/+20!!

Before you tell me it cannot work: Sharpshooter says 'Before you make an attack with a ranged weapon.' Clearly, using the longbow to make a melee attack is an attack with a ranged weapon, as opposed to a ranged weapon attack.

This is technically correct by RAW, though I can’t imagine any DM allowing it.

 

[MikalC]

The Loading property wouldn’t interfere with using a crossbow to make a melee attack.

Ah but if you keep the qualities of the original weapon you do, because that ALSO means you keep the ammunition quality, which means you’d also need to use that ammo whenever making a melee attack.
If you’re going to assume you keep all qualities, then you have to use all qualities, not cherry pick them.

Since making a melee attack with a ranged weapon does not require you to fire a piece of ammunition from it, the Loading property does not prevent you from doing so multiple times in a turn.

except that ammunition rules state each time you make an attack (any attack. It doesn’t specify ranged only except in the fluff description) you must use ammo, which thus triggers loading.

but again, it’s all moot as it’s already been pointed out where Crawford clarified an improvised weapon loses all its original qualities when used as an improvised weapon. You know, like the RAW says (unless you can point out where it says in improvised weapons that the ranged weapon used in melee keeps its original qualities)

So...yeah. Either they keep them all and you use stuff like ammunition and loading along with heavy, or they don’t.

 

[MikalC]

Okey-dokey. You do you. Trading personal insults about intelligence and reading comprehension seems a little gauche though. Especially when the difference between using and interpreting seems to have somehow vanished like a puff of smoke. Anyway, moving on. Have a good one.

No worries. I’ll continue using the RAW for this because it makes sense and doesn’t do something stupid like assume you can GWM with a longbow