D&D 5E How Many 5Es Can There Be?

[Tony Vargas]

5e and OSR both try to re-capture the past. But, I think they do so at different levels, and from different viewpoints, for different audiences. Like, 5e really wanted to re-capture the unit sales of the past, and it did, spectacularly. It captured the phenom of new players trying 5e, and then never trying any other RPG. It re-capture DMs taking full responsibility for the game sucking like a supermassive black hole. etc...
5e's not a re-print nor is it driven by pure nostalgia of the folks who played back then, it's derivative of that, but it's pointed at a new audience, it's presentation is for that audience. It's awkward at times, but you can't argue with the sales.

As I just commented above, 5e re-captures the phenomenon of every DM running a different D&D from every other DM.
OSR games re-capture a sampling of those individual DM's D&Ds, like, one per OSR game. OSR is like, intimate, nostalgic, it actually is selling to the old crowd (and whomever they can recruit), and it's selling as close to (memories of) the old experience as it can get. And, those experiences are varied - so no wonder there's so many OSR games!

 

[EzekielRaiden]

5e just can't stop winning at that particular goal.

Much to my chagrin.

Flexibility and adaptation are virtues. "You literally have no idea what will be true from one session to the next"...not so much.

 

[Hussar]

I've pointed it out a few times, but what the heck.
5e set out to capture the feel of the classic game, along with many other, less attainable goals.
Back in the 80s, every DM ran D&D differently from every other DM - especially the ones who insisted they were running "by the book, with no variants."

5e just can't stop winning at that particular goal.

And one only needs look at the responses to this point to see it proven over and over again.

The myth that there is a “classic “ way of playing DnD is one of those things that people just can’t seem to let go of.

My Basic/expert games were far, far more gonzo than anything WotC has banged out. And our aesthetics in the 80’s had nothing to do wity what a lot of people consider classic.

There is no such monster as “classic” DnD.

 

[AnotherGuy]

5e and D&D in general is swimming in options these days. As a tinkerer I'm overwhelmed.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I don't get this impression from 5e culture at all. Balance is basically ignored in non EN D&D discussions and the "these are my house rules" blogs and vids do bonkers numbers

Yeah, I sometimes see a “RAW only” comment on twitter or someone obsessing over how broken some perfectly fine option is, but mostly it’s DIY and houserules.

Much to my chagrin.

Flexibility and adaptation are virtues. "You literally have no idea what will be true from one session to the next"...not so much.

Eh I’m glad 5e is an open toolbox. Hopefully 2024 will bring better guidance and explanations, but not much more actual rails for DMs.

 

[delericho]

I'm guessing that the 5e 2014 will fade away as people get the new 5e 2024 books.

It will actually be really interesting to see what happens. In the past, every time there has been a revision, TSR or WotC found that their biggest competitor was the previous version(s) of the game.

But we're now at a point where, for the vast majority of the player base, this is actually their first revision. So... will the old pattern continue, will the market move on en masse, or will people just stick with what they have?

 

[Hussar]

It will actually be really interesting to see what happens. In the past, every time there has been a revision, TSR or WotC found that their biggest competitor was the previous version(s) of the game.

But we're now at a point where, for the vast majority of the player base, this is actually their first revision. So... will the old pattern continue, will the market move on en masse, or will people just stick with what they have?

It's a bit different this time around though.

In the past, when a new edition came around, not only did you need to buy your new core books, but you had to replace your entire library. This time around, you can still use most of your books with the new books. There's nothing stopping you from running Out of the Abyss with the new books. It's not even a case of updating or converting. The straight up modules and things like Xanathar's and Volo's still straight up work. I don't know how much that played into other people's buying patterns but it certainly affected mine. When 3e rolled out, I didn't switch. It wasn't until two years in that I bought the new books, mostly because I joined a new group that was using the new edition. When 3.5 came out, my buying dropped to almost nil. Just the core books and a few odds and sods and I didn't even buy a 3.5 DMG. 4e was the same - core only and that's mostly because of 3 book set.

This time around, you can do things a lot more piecemeal. If you buy a 2024 PHB when it first releases, you don't really need to buy anything else. Over time, you buy the MM and the DMG as needed. I think you'll see a lot of hybrid groups.

The bigger difference, IMO, will be D&D Beyond. So many gamers are digital now. Buy the 2024 core 3 and it's integrated with your 2014 source books and possibly the new VTT and suddenly making the shift is pretty easy.

 

[Parmandur]

It will actually be really interesting to see what happens. In the past, every time there has been a revision, TSR or WotC found that their biggest competitor was the previous version(s) of the game.

But we're now at a point where, for the vast majority of the player base, this is actually their first revision. So... will the old pattern continue, will the market move on en masse, or will people just stick with what they have?

A lot, and I mean a lot, of mixing and matching...which WotC is actively designing to encourage.

It's a bit different this time around though.

In the past, when a new edition came around, not only did you need to buy your new core books, but you had to replace your entire library. This time around, you can still use most of your books with the new books. There's nothing stopping you from running Out of the Abyss with the new books. It's not even a case of updating or converting. The straight up modules and things like Xanathar's and Volo's still straight up work. I don't know how much that played into other people's buying patterns but it certainly affected mine. When 3e rolled out, I didn't switch. It wasn't until two years in that I bought the new books, mostly because I joined a new group that was using the new edition. When 3.5 came out, my buying dropped to almost nil. Just the core books and a few odds and sods and I didn't even buy a 3.5 DMG. 4e was the same - core only and that's mostly because of 3 book set.

This time around, you can do things a lot more piecemeal. If you buy a 2024 PHB when it first releases, you don't really need to buy anything else. Over time, you buy the MM and the DMG as needed. I think you'll see a lot of hybrid groups.

The bigger difference, IMO, will be D&D Beyond. So many gamers are digital now. Buy the 2024 core 3 and it's integrated with your 2014 source books and possibly the new VTT and suddenly making the shift is pretty easy.

More than a few tables might see juat the new Monster Manual get used behind the screen, or some other piecemeal bits. I learned the game Ina weird mish-mazh of 3E and 3.5, whi h took some effort, but WotC is designing to facilitate that this go around.

 

[Zardnaar]

Well, in the 80s there was 0D&D, Basic D&D, 1e AD&D, B/X, BECMI, Arduin Grimoire, Tunnels & Trolls, Judges' Guild, and so forth.

So, lots. Whatever the market will bear.

Ultimately this.

I don't see to much rage over1D&D apathy might kill it.

Personally I don't feel like paying for errata. I'll probably pick it up later. Amazing word of mouth might swing it though

Predictions.

1D&D 1st place.
5E holduts 2nd.
Kobold Press 3rd place

Everything else is a blip in grand scheme of things.

I'll wait and see tossing up between KP 1D&D or making 5E last an extra year or 2.

 

[Stormonu]

It's a bit different this time around though.

In the past, when a new edition came around, not only did you need to buy your new core books, but you had to replace your entire library. This time around, you can still use most of your books with the new books. There's nothing stopping you from running Out of the Abyss with the new books. It's not even a case of updating or converting. The straight up modules and things like Xanathar's and Volo's still straight up work. I don't know how much that played into other people's buying patterns but it certainly affected mine. When 3e rolled out, I didn't switch. It wasn't until two years in that I bought the new books, mostly because I joined a new group that was using the new edition. When 3.5 came out, my buying dropped to almost nil. Just the core books and a few odds and sods and I didn't even buy a 3.5 DMG. 4e was the same - core only and that's mostly because of 3 book set.

This time around, you can do things a lot more piecemeal. If you buy a 2024 PHB when it first releases, you don't really need to buy anything else. Over time, you buy the MM and the DMG as needed. I think you'll see a lot of hybrid groups.

The bigger difference, IMO, will be D&D Beyond. So many gamers are digital now. Buy the 2024 core 3 and it's integrated with your 2014 source books and possibly the new VTT and suddenly making the shift is pretty easy.

1E to 2E had a lot of that too, you could use old 1E adventures and books (such as Manual of the Planes) with 2E with no or minimal conversion. I think for that's the right way to go for 2024 - still being able to use the majority of your existing books and having the option to upgrade your core books retains existing players and giving new players a slightly better start.

I've have no desire to buy the 2024 core books, but if future adventures and supplements still work with the 2014 books, there's a good chance I'll buy those.