Legolas trick (Discussion from General)

[Nail]

Visualize it this way: drawing an arrow is part of an attack.....

FWIW, I don't think most people here are having trouble "visualizing" how a bow and arrow are used. What's being debated is whether or not the rules text supports more than just the obvious use for the drawn arrow.

 

[Nail]

If it said:

"Drawing ammunition (such as arrows, bolts, sling bullets, or shuriken) is a free action."

I would have agreed with you long ago. The middle part of the sentence cannot be ignored. You are infering that it has no meaning whereas the meaning appears clear.

Drawing ammunition when using it with a ranged weapon is a free action, otherwise it is not. Just like getting out material components when casting a spell is a free action, but only for casting a spell.

Alright, that tipped the scales for me, FWIW. I agree with KD.

Since "use" is defined on a round by round (turn by turn) basis, you simply don't have the ability to hold onto an arrow "between" uses.

 

[molonel]

If it said:

I would have agreed with you long ago. The middle part of the sentence cannot be ignored. You are infering that it has no meaning whereas the meaning appears clear.

Drawing ammunition when using it with a ranged weapon is a free action, otherwise it is not. Just like getting out material components when casting a spell is a free action, but only for casting a spell.

For the record, I think this is the correct rules interpretation, and I would freely ignore it and let a ranger pull a Legolas if the opportunity arose.

 

[green slime]

For the record, I think this is the correct rules interpretation, and I would freely ignore it and let a ranger pull a Legolas if the opportunity arose.

Hear, hear!

I second, (or third, or whatever) this opinion.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

I think it's worth mentioning again that I don't consider to take this discussion too serious in regard of how I'm gaming

If you need to "ready" the weapon as a move action as you say, then why is it allowed to cast a spell and "ready" a greatsword in both hands afterwards for AoOs as a free action?

Ahh, but this is the rules forum... in which it is customary to chase down the little nits and wits of ill-properly turned grammer

I don't take this too seriously either, but I prefer to have a solid ruling to fall back on when the NPC pulls the same stunt and the player wants to whine about it.

The greatsword bit is another nit floating around concerning two-handed weapons that can basically be quick-drawn once properly wielded...which doesn't match with the other nits floating around this issue. In the long run, at least to me, its a cool manuever that I would want my players to be able to choose as an option, but with penalties so they don't whine when the NPC's pull it on them...

 

[Darklone]

Ahh, but this is the rules forum... in which it is customary to chase down the little nits and wits of ill-properly turned grammer

Like this funny thread here proved once again

I don't take this too seriously either, but I prefer to have a solid ruling to fall back on when the NPC pulls the same stunt and the player wants to whine about it.

The greatsword bit is another nit floating around concerning two-handed weapons that can basically be quick-drawn once properly wielded...which doesn't match with the other nits floating around this issue. In the long run, at least to me, its a cool manuever that I would want my players to be able to choose as an option, but with penalties so they don't whine when the NPC's pull it on them...

Same here. Yet: I simply don't allow that stuff. I have a guideline: What you do on your action is done over the round... flavorwise. So yes, you can use a polearm and use a spiked gauntlet for AoOs... TWF penalties please.

And since flavor tops most of the silly "rules" (because I don't consider ill-properly turned grammer to be rules) in that way, it never comes up. People act stylish. Archers drop their bows before the melee dude can break it and change to melee weaponry. Clerics who fight with greatswords do so... and leave the spellcasting to others as long as enemies are close.