New Kelvin Timeline Star Trek film goes into production late 2022

[payn]

"Jupiter Ascending" was an amazing big screen experience, but an absolutely horrible movie. Cinematography and action can't save everything

I'll take your word for it. I saw JA on stream and turned it off shortly after starting.

 

[Umbran]

If you're an older Star Trek fan, the degree to which you are harrumphing the Kelvin movies may be overlooking the people who just found some movies they enjoy as movies.


(And yes, I am very excited for another one! While they aren't perfect, they have largely been fun and with characters I enjoy. Given the history of Star Trek movies, that hasn't always been a given.)

I will grant - the Kelvin timeline movies have been excellent if what you really wanted was a way to pass a really hot summer afternoon in an air-conditioned space with a frosty beverage and a snack.

Do they hold up to later cogitation? No. But I wasn't going to be cogitating much while sweating in the summer heat anyway, so...

 

[MGibster]

It turns out the galaxy is a very dangerous place. You'll find lots of exploratory expeditions in our history carried weapons - Magellan is known for demonstrating arms, armor, and artillery, for example.

On the other hand, I'd be hard pressed to tell Moctezuma that Cortés and his merry band of invaders weren't warriors or soldiers.

I think the distinction comes in the idea that the primary purpose of a military organization is to engage in warfare. This distinguishes them from police or peacekeeping forces, which are also armed, but not generally intended to engage in warfare.

I would agree, I think that's the distinction most people are going by. But it's a distinction that didn't exist in the original series and was a conceit that started sometime before The Wrath of Khan when Roddenberry was kind of off his rocker when it came to Star Trek.

1. In "Errand of Mercy" (1968), Kirk says, "I'm a soldier, not a diplomat."
2. In "The Ultimate Computer" (1968), several Constitution class ships gather together for wargames.
3. "Errand of Mercy" (again), the Federation and Klingon fleets converge near Organia to battle one another for control of the area. i.e. Star Fleet is there to prosecute a war on behalf of the Federation.
4. In "Arena" (1967), the Enterprise is dispatched to investigate the unprovoked destruction of a Federation outpost. Kirk pursues the unknown enemy with the intention of destroying their ship.
5. In "Court Martial" (1967), Captain Kirk was tried in a military court.
6. In "A Private Little War" (1968), the Enterprise engages in a proxy war against the Klingons by arming and training natives.

Admittedly, this brings into question what counts as "warfare". We can note that Starfleet isn't known for putting together large groups of ships to engage in violence, except in defensive actions like Wolf 359 and the Dominion War, which the Federation did not start. If they are not usually gathered in tactically relevant groups, it is hard to consider them military.

Engaging in defensive actions counts as warfare. Sometime between the end of the series and 1982's Wrath of Khan, Roddenberry decided that Star Fleet was no longer a military organization. He had a big problem with WoK because he felt it militarized Star Fleet but because of the poor performance of the first movie he wasn't really in charge. But his idea that Star Fleet wasn't a military wormed its way into TNG.

 

[MGibster]

The original scene was between two colleagues who had been friends for decades. They had been through everything together and stuck by each other through it all. It was just an amazing scene.

Yeah. In the original, we establish that Kirk has always been able to cheat no-win situations and even death itself. Finally, for the first time, he's faced with a situation where it's not possible to cheat death. Spock is going to die and there's nothing he can do about it. It was a great scene played out rather well by both Nimoy and Shatner and it resonated with audiences precisely because of their past. The relationship between Quinto and Pine just didn't hold a candle to that. How could it? They were only in one movie together.

 

[Umbran]

On the other hand, I'd be hard pressed to tell Moctezuma that Cortés and his merry band of invaders weren't warriors or soldiers.

Yeah, but Cortés' charter was not for exploration, but for securing the interior of Mexico for colonization. He wasn't an explorer, but was explicitly a conqueror.

 

[MarkB]

Nemesis has some issues, but it has one of the best space battles in the franchise. It's the cloaked-ship showdown that Star Trek VI's finale should have been, but wasn't.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Nemesis has some issues, but it has one of the best space battles in the franchise. It's the cloaked-ship showdown that Star Trek VI's finale should have been, but wasn't.

Is that similar to, "Other than that, how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?"

 

[Ryujin]

I think, when you come right down to it, there's no modern analogue that we can point to when it comes to Star Fleet, and only cursory likeness to the past. If Cortez's mission was to investigate Mexico and make contact with any native inhabitants he found, in order to forge a mutual defence and trade pact, with the codicil that they defend themselves and others if attacked, we might be close.

 

[GreyLord]

Why? Does anyone actually want to see more of these (bad) movies?

Yes.

For one, I would see it.

 

[GreyLord]

Oh, I remember seeing the reviews, and being shocked. I also remember asking myself, friends and my wife if I'm crazy and living in an alternate universe after having read those reviews!

Well, I REALLY liked the First Star Trek (2009) and Into Darkness, speaking for myself. I can understand why the general public may like and enjoy them.

I couldn't understand WHY a lot of those on the boards went wild over Beyond. It was decent, but no where as good (to me, at least) as the first two.

It seems there are many that also see it similarly.

I think there IS a disconnect between what some fans view in Star Trek and what general fans (I would not classify myself as a hardcore Trekkie or Trekker, but I've watched all the series and movies, and even went to the Experience when it was still open) like myself prefer or enjoy sometimes.